Synthetic Motor Oil

[TidalGT]

What's the best synthetic? Any thoughts?

[slow 2K2GT]

Amsoil turbo formulated 10W30 100% synthetic. Price tag $11CDN per quart. Guaranteed for 25,000 miles or 1 full year.

[obi_one]

I got to go with mobil1 :D
not shure bout living oil for a year in my car :)

[2loud2k2xd]

switching my reg oil for mobile1 tomorrow at work. our dealership only uses mobile1 for audi and porsche.

but ive heard amsoil is the best.

[Soron]

Please read http://www.elantraxd.com/forums/showthread.php?t=9942 regarding amsoil. Royal Purple has to be the best out there, as they actually claim on their website they are 400% better than other synthetics and it is the only website that I have seen that makes any claim over other synthetics. I run Valvoline Synpower in mine, can't afford R.P. right now with these high gas prices.

I'm not too keen on the idea of leaving oil in a car that long either, but you have to change the oil filter every 3k and then top off. Each filter holds around a quart of oil (for decent sized ones like the K&N filter I got on mine) so you are basically replacing/regenerating 1/4 of your oil with every filter change and the rest gets filtered out till the next change which is why is lasts awhile. The reason most people still go with 3k oil changes is because if they gotta replace the filter why not the oil while they are at it, especially if its dino?

[slow 2K2GT]

Hey thanks that was a good read, perhaps than I retract my statement about Amsoil and will be doing an oil change at the end of the month. I find my engine is burning that stuff really fast, actually I find a lot of oil in my intake tube so I think my rings may also be going...man its just an all around bad day.

[o2coolchris]

I agree with the Royal Purple... that stuff kicks ***... about $5-$6 USD a quart though... but worth it IMO

[SilverBullet]

The service rep at my local dealership said that Synthetic Motor Oil is not recommended. He didn't really explain why....

[BobMs_wht2k2]

If you're still under warranty, you still have to change your oil around the 3k mile mark to keep your warranty intact. So unless you have money that you want to throw away spending $4-5 a quart for synthetic oil is going to be a waste. If you could run it fir 7500 miles or so between oil changes than it would be worth it.

Just my opinion here. I've run it in the past but it just gets too expensive. Unfortunately I don't have unlimited funds.

[2001GLS]

If you're still under warranty, you still have to change your oil around the 3k mile mark to keep your warranty intact. So unless you have money that you want to throw away spending $4-5 a quart for synthetic oil is going to be a waste. If you could run it fir 7500 miles or so between oil changes than it would be worth it.

Just my opinion here. I've run it in the past but it just gets too expensive. Unfortunately I don't have unlimited funds.

Hyundai warranty requirement is only once every 6 months or 7500 miles for regular driving, even under the more severe driving conditions it's 3700 miles.

[SilverBullet]

I believe the rep mentioned something about "Hydraulic Lash Adjustment", I honestly don't remember the terms he threw at me, but he said that synthetic could cause certain overhead internals to stick.

I was just wondering if there is a mechanical conflict when using synthetic on the beta II.

[Soron]

personally im surprised by the fact that a rep would be against a synthetic motor oil cause it "sticks" components together, I though synthetics were engineered to be superior to dino oil in every way, can anyone elaborate on this?

[BlackElantraGT]

I've had Mobil 1 Synthetic after my first oil change. This last time I put in the new Mobil 1 Synthetic extended, which supposedly lasts for 15K miles or 1 year. There is no mention of having to change the oil filter every 3K miles. Synthetic oil changes were getting a bit too expensive, even at every 7500 miles or so. I'm gonna try this out and see how it goes.

I don't like the idea of leaving oil in my car for a year either, but Mobil 1 knows their oil and if they can back up a claim of 15K miles, they seem to be pretty confident in their product. I think there's something that they know that the other manufacturers are afraid of admitting to. Why would Mobil 1 want to lose customers by extending their oil changes? The extra cost with the extended oils don't even cover the cost of losing all those quarts they could have sold with regular synthetic oil.

[Mr. Dan]

The only concern for me is how well it lubricates. I change my oil, oil filter and air filter every 2500-3000km. It costs me about $20 American. I asked the Hyundai mechanic if I should use fancy oil and he said no. All the synthetics last longer but I've never seen any that claim to lube better unless you are running turbo or some other fancy gear. Why should I pay a pile of money for fancy oil when it costs so little to just change it more often?

[obi_one]

i've been useing mobil1 on my previus car it was an accent 96 for 9 years with regular changes every 6000km and had not 1 problem with the engine so i guess i'll stick with it :)

[Soron]

BlackElantraGT, You dont have to change your mobile 1 oil every 3k, just the filter and top off to replace what the filter had in it, you only need to change out the entire synthetic every 15k, the oi is designed to last 15k, but the filter is only designed to last 3-4k. Please see http://www.elantraxd.com/forums/showthread.php?t=9942 regarding synthetics.

[blupupher]

I believe the rep mentioned something about "Hydraulic Lash Adjustment", I honestly don't remember the terms he threw at me, but he said that synthetic could cause certain overhead internals to stick.

I was just wondering if there is a mechanical conflict when using synthetic on the beta II.
I remember Sed had said something about this a while back, but it was regarding the oils weight, not the type (he said thicker was better).

[BlackElantraGT]

BlackElantraGT, You dont have to change your mobile 1 oil every 3k, just the filter and top off to replace what the filter had in it, you only need to change out the entire synthetic every 15k, the oi is designed to last 15k, but the filter is only designed to last 3-4k. Please see http://www.elantraxd.com/forums/showthread.php?t=9942 regarding synthetics.

I went to Mobil 1's website and read up on their FAQs and here's what it says regarding changing your oil filter:

"If I go longer between oil change intervals, do I need to change my oil filter more frequently? Or do I need a special filter?
Continue to change your oil filter when you change your engine oil. Special filters, or more frequent oil filter changes are not required.

However, Mobil 1 Oil Filters provide outstanding performance during longer oil change intervals. Mobil 1 Oil Filters are designed to offer excellent efficiency (remove more engine oil impurities) and high capacity (60 percent greater capacity than conventional oil filters), which make them ideal candidates for longer oil change intervals. "

I currently use Mobil 1 oil filters along with their oil.

Here's a link to their FAQs website:
http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/MotorOil/Oils/Oils_FAQs.aspx#Mobil_1_Extended_Performance_FAQs1

[Soron]

I use K&N gold series filter myself, it's tougher and just as good if not better than most filters, I would still change the filter every 3k in any case, unless someone has done some sort of study showing that the filters today can actually go that long (I was taught in auto class it doesent). I see 2 mobile 1 filters at checker auto that fit the elantra, which one should I get? I was considering on trying this out over my K&N, how does it perform? Does it use synthetic or cellulose media? I choose the K&N filter because it had a higher burst strength, 1" nut on the end for removal and the synthetic media.

[BlackElantraGT]

I use K&N gold series filter myself, it's tougher and just as good if not better than most filters, I would still change the filter every 3k in any case, unless someone has done some sort of study showing that the filters today can actually go that long (I was taught in auto class it doesent). I see 2 mobile 1 filters at checker auto that fit the elantra, which one should I get? I was considering on trying this out over my K&N, how does it perform? Does it use synthetic or cellulose media? I choose the K&N filter because it had a higher burst strength, 1" nut on the end for removal and the synthetic media.

Mobil 1 is synthetic media.

Here's what this guy had to say about Mobil 1 oil filters after doing a study of many different filters:

"Mobil 1


M1-301



Like the Champion, this filter is made by Champion Industries. However, it uses a unique end plate and a thicker can that make it the strongest filter available for wide-distribution retail sale. It also does not use the fragile paper media of the Champion filter. I’m happy to say that this filter is NOT a fake. It is definitely a unique design.

It uses a synthetic fiber element that can filter out very small particles and is much stronger than the fragile, Champion paper media. It is rated just under the Purolator Pure One as far as filtering capability, but is still very much above conventional paper filters. It also has a very strong construction to withstand high-pressure spikes during start-up. Given the choice between the Purolator Pure One and the Mobil 1 filters, I would choose the Mobil 1 because of the restriction concerns of the Pure One and that pesky assembly string. However, as with all Mobil 1 products, expect to pay 2 - 3 times as much for this filter."

You can check out that website here:
http://www.scuderiaciriani.com/rx7/oil_filter_study/

If Mobil tells me their oil can last up to 15K miles or 1 year, and there's no need to change your oil filter every 3K, I'm going to follow their instructions. They know a lot more about oil than any of us.

[Soron]

Im impressed with the mobile 1 filter, it has a higher burst strength than the K&N and higher filtration efficiancy, guess im switching next filter change.
Like I said before, the oil may be designed to last 15k but the filter I bet is not, ask the filter manufacturer how long their filters are designed to last, regardless of what oil is in them, in fact im going to email mobil 1 right now to ask them just that.

[southpawboston]

a word of caution, hyundai has issued a TSB for engine ticking noise when using aftermarket oil filters. apparently the hyundai OEM filter is designed with a specific flow rate that other aftermarket filters may not be capable of. why take a risk and use an aftermarket product on such an important "warranty keeper"? just stick with OEM, and hyundai can never try to deny you warranty repair for oil-related engine faiure.

[Soron]

Yes I know of the tsb, there was a topic here on that already http://www.elantraxd.com/forums/showthread.php?t=9225&highlight=oil+filter+tsb , it's just hyundai trying to increase filter sales I say imo. Paper filter over synthetic? I choose synthetic (better filtration and higher flow rates than paper media) as for the ticking noise I heard here on the boards it can be "cured" by using heavier grade oil ie 10w40.

By fordfasterr

The dealer & hyundai ( sed ? ) claims that the thicker oil eliminates the valve tappet noise that many people experience so they simply use thicker oil to fill any " clearnaces " left by the thinner oil..

http://www.elantraxd.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7925&highlight=thicker+oil

I have already written to K&N and Mobile 1 ragarding their oil filter longevity, if both say it can go that long, than hey more power to ya and mines staying on till my next oil change.

[XTRAWLD]

I'm a Royal Purple girl, with K&N filters...and I have Redline in the Tranny.

[BlackElantraGT]

I have already written to K&N and Mobile 1 ragarding their oil filter longevity, if both say it can go that long, than hey more power to ya and mines staying on till my next oil change.

I already posted what Mobil 1 says about oil filter replacement that Mobil posted on their FAQs page. I'm sure this question has been asked numerous time, hence the reason why it's on their Frequently Asked Questions page. What's the point of asking? They'll give you the same answer that I posted on here from their website.

I think we're all skeptical about this because most of us grew up with dino oil and learned from our dads about the 3,000 mile oil change rule. Technology changes constantly and sometimes we have to completely relearn what we were originally taught because that information is outdated now. I think that time has come with engine oil.

When you really think about it, Mobil 1 hardly benefits from releasing a 15K extended synthetic oil and telling people that the oil filter only needs to be changed only when the oil is changed. For every customer that purchases the new 15K extended oil, that's 4 oil changes that they are losing. Yes, the new oil does cost about $2-4 per jug, but that is no where close to recovering the cost of the 4 oil changes that they've lost.

Now, to recover this deficit, they could have easily marketed their oil and said, "Hey, if you wanna use this 15K extended synthetic oil, you have to use our oil filter only and it has to be changed at every 3K interval". Their oil filter for our Elantras cost $11.99 from AutoZone. That's a lot of money for an oil filter. Multiply that by 5 and they could have had $60 in sales of oil filter.

But that's not what they did. Instead, they tell you that you can use most oil filters and that it will last until you do your oil change. However, they do take this opportunity to market their oil filter being superior to other filters, which I would expect them to do. And they're not bull****ting their product either, their oil filter has been proven to be better than most of their competitors.

Let me use an analogy to put this into perspective. You've been having a really bad stomach ache for days now. You go to the doctor and he says you're gonna need your appendix taken out. You don't like the doctor's answer, so you go to Jose, your buddy at work that gives you all your advice and sells you weed every payday. Jose says, "I have stomache aches all the time! Just take some Pepto-Bismol cabron!"

Of the 2 people, who would you rather take advice from?

Same scenario here, you could either take advice from Mobil, or a bunch of strangers on an internet forum who really knows nothing about oil since most of us do not work in that industry.

[05xd]

I use 20w50 castrol syntech every 2500 miles...yea i know, why bother right?i run the tar outta my car, thats why i change it so often.that and it looks good from my side just in case something happens

[Soron]

Got my replies from both mobile 1 and K&N already, wasent expecting such a quick response.

Here is the Email from K&N

Dear Customer,

The maximum life is 6,000 miles. The filter should be replace at every oil change or 6,000.

Thanks for writing

Fred

K&N technical Support


-----Original Message-----
From: Soron [mailto:Soron@SoftHome.net]
Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 11:43 AM
To: Tech Support
Subject: oil filter information

Hello, I am a member of an automotive forum (www.elantraxd.com) and we are currently discussing oil and filter life. I personlly use your gold series oil filter and we were wondering how long are your oil fitlers desgined to last? some say 15k miles and others say 3k, we would like to put this issue to rest so any help would be greatly appreciated! great product by the way! On a related note, I am using valvolines synthetic oil synpower and would like to know how long I can expect your filter to perform in my car before I change it. Thanks in advance!


Here is the Email from Mobil 1

The Mobil1 oil filter is not marketed with a specific mile limit but,
can be taken to the same drain interval as the motor oil being used or
to whatever the auto manufacturer's limit may be. The motor oil used and
the engine in question has huge bearing on how long and oil filter can
be used. If you would like a general statement 7,500 iles/ 1year which
ever first is a safe guideline to follow.

-Matt

--
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.10.15/81 - Release Date: 8/24/2005



As you an see each oil filter pretty much does have a limit before it has to be changed, some longer than others but its pretty safe to say that its still safe to change the filter more often than the oil, as synthetic oil will outlast the filter in most cases. As I specified earlier, I was considering going to a mobil 1 filter already, now I even have more of a reason, it lasts another 1500 miles longer than a k&n filter. Even though the oil may last 15k, it still has to be changed eventually. The mobil 1 filter according to the manufacturer generallly lasts 7500 miles but you have to take into account that there is a variance, but I seriously doubt that variance is another 7500 miles (double their quoted general usage rate).

I'm not saying don't go with the oil manufacturers oil change interval, in fact I would recommend it, but you also have to take into consideration the manufactuer of the oil filter and what they recommend what the oil filter change rate should be as the filter they designed is only designed to last so long. K&N and mobile 1 oil filters probably last as long as they do because they use synthetic media, paper oil filters would probably have disintregrated long before it ever saw 15k, no matter who manufactured them.

[Estopatitiana]

mobile one is good, ive been running it in mine for 40k every 3000 and there is almost no sludge, the oil is barely black when i drain it, and i have 80k on the car and it purrs, and i dont care if people say you dont have to change synthetic for like 5000 miles, not the way i drive

[900Z1]

I use Castrol Syntec 10/30. Change every 3000 miles. Might not be the best Oil in the world, but works for me.

[jp_recon]

I thought that we weren't supposed to be using FULL Synthetic oil in our engines due to the thinner viscosity. I don't know much about our engines, but from what I've heard, normal daily driven 4cyl engines should only use regular or blended synthetic oils. I have only used blended synthetic 10w30 oils and fram/mobil1 filters. I am just now starting to hear a faint ticking sound from the engine at 65K miles. I'm going to change back to the OEM filters to see if there is any reduced engine noise. I would really like to know the true facts on these oil issues.

JP

[Soron]

I thought that we weren't supposed to be using FULL Synthetic oil in our engines due to the thinner viscosity. I don't know much about our engines, but from what I've heard, normal daily driven 4cyl engines should only use regular or blended synthetic oils. I have only used blended synthetic 10w30 oils and fram/mobil1 filters. I am just now starting to hear a faint ticking sound from the engine at 65K miles. I'm going to change back to the OEM filters to see if there is any reduced engine noise. I would really like to know the true facts on these oil issues.

JP

The viscosity of synthetic oil is exactly the same as conventional oil, thats why its rated 10w30 for a 10w30 oil, as for the ticking sound it can be "fixed" by just using a higher viscosity oil ie 10w40, posted elsewhere on the site. The reason they dont want you to use synthetic is because it "may" cause valve sticking or noise, but personally I think its a mechanical problem as if it is a true lubrication problem we would have seen a post on it by some member not just on this site but another about their personal experiance and how the dealer determined it to be the oils fault and provided evidence to prove it.

[Dust]

The viscosity of most types of M1 is lower than most comparable dinos. I would look at these listings, and decide from there.
http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=3;t=002870#000000

http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=3;t=002429#000000

http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=3;t=000823#000000

[Soron]

Sorry but I just read all of the posts you posted dust and I see no evidence of mobile 1 having a lower viscosity than any dino as it wasent even mentioned in any of the posts, the only ones I saw being compared were royal purple 10w30, GC (graphic and data is missing) and castrol 0w30 in which case there is a diffrence in weight and viscosity of the oils but only because r.p. was a 10w30 and castrol was a 0w30/ strait weight 30 oil.

If the viscosity of mobile 1 really is lower than most dinos then they wouldent be able to sell it at the weight they specify as it could cause engine damage from using too light a weight of oil (example mobile 1's 10w30 is really a 5w30) and I can safely say thats not a risk they are willing to take, its just easier to reclassify it as the lower viscosity oil. Dino oils can have the same viscosity range as a synthetics, its just that synthetics last longer and are just plain better.

[Dust]

Sorry but I just read all of the posts you posted dust and I see no evidence of mobile 1 having a lower viscosity than any dino as it wasent even mentioned in any of the posts, the only ones I saw being compared were royal purple 10w30, GC (graphic and data is missing) and castrol 0w30 in which case there is a diffrence in weight and viscosity of the oils but only because r.p. was a 10w30 and castrol was a 0w30/ strait weight 30 oil.

If the viscosity of mobile 1 really is lower than most dinos then they wouldent be able to sell it at the weight they specify as it could cause engine damage from using too light a weight of oil (example mobile 1's 10w30 is really a 5w30) and I can safely say thats not a risk they are willing to take, its just easier to reclassify it as the lower viscosity oil. Dino oils can have the same viscosity range as a synthetics, its just that synthetics last longer and are just plain better.


Viscosity isn't a number, it's a range of number

Let me refer you here

http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=11;t=000310

Mobil 1 info was from the mobil 1 website

Mobil 1 10-30 Vis 10.0

Supertech Dino 10.8

Redline 10-30 11.4

Valvoline 11.5

Superlude Cenex 11.5

Neo Syn 11.75

Castrol GC 12.1 or 12.2

This is about three minutes in the VOA section.

The links to UOA's were pasted so that people here could read what is actually going on with oil in Elantra engines, not just some guy said that "insert oil name here" worked for my 1969 BBC, so it should work for your I-4 jjust the same. DId you read the comments that were made after the info was posted? Helps to get a feel of what is going on in the engine. Rather than just internet bench race, try out an oil for 5K miles, spend $20 to get it tested, and see how your filter, and your oil are doing. I would guess that even Havoline 10-30 would run for 5000 or more in a good running engine, but since I am not anywhere near an elantra, I couldn't really tell you.

But this is coming from the guy who will install a bypass filter when the warranty runs out, and cuts open oil filters for fun.

[JuMpMaN6235]

i have a quick question... So far i have never changed oil for a car in my life, i usually just take it to a gas station pay $20 and let them do it, but now i want to start doing it myslef cuz i know those gas stations use cheap *** oil.... anywayz, i was thinking of getting regular mobil 1 or Mobil 1 Extended Performance with their filters... what does 5w-30, 10w-40, etc mean? and which one do i need? also anyone know where i can find a DIY for changing my oil, i feel like such a newb

[Soron]

JumpMan6235:
5w30 referers the the viscosity of the oil at a certain temperature, the lower refers to the oils viscosity at lower temperatures and the higher number at higher temperatures.. You can get strait weight oils ie 30W. The ones rated for elantras are 5w30 - 10w40, you use a 5 or 0w30 oil in colder climates such as canada or alaska and 10w40 oil in hot climates like here in arizona, 10w30 oil is an all around climate oil, since you're indetroit I would suggest a 5w30 oil since fall/winter is comming on.

Dust:
Yes I read every comment and saw everyone of them was related to an elantra and that those were oil tests, i'm not a true oil guru, yet, but I am an oil freak. Do you mean an remote oil filter bypass plate? I hope so as bypassing the oil filter itself, needless to say, is very bad. I know viscosity is a range of numbers as we are talking about multi-weight oils and their is some variation but an oil of a certain weight, say 10w30, would have a rating of say 15, but another oil of the same weight has a rating of 14 but for it to be classified as a 10w30 oil the oils must fall within the range of say 13-16. If it was a strait weight oil it would be a single number but still must fall within a certain weight range, but in any case the point is moot when the oil range tolerances are so close to the point most people can't tell the difference, I mean who cares if a gallon of brand A oil flows 1 gallon of oil through a 1" opening over 3 seconds when brand B oil flows the same amount over the same opening over 3.05 seconds.

using your own data from the website, all oils are 10w30 based

Mobile 1 Vis @ 100 10.7
Chevron Vis @ 100 12
Redline Vis @ 100 11.4

mobil 1 is the least viscous of the 3 compared, by comparison the viscosity of water at 25 °C is 0.008904, and the viscosity range of a 10w40 oil is 13.8 - 14.6 according to the chart on the website.

Thinner and thicker oils have their merits and downfalls, thinner oils lubricate better in cold temps but not at high, thicker oil can cause an engine to seize at low temps but protects better at high temps, which is why muti-viscosity oils are created but in doing so creates a range of viscosities within the 10w30 range.

[Dust]

JumpMan6235:
Do you mean an remote oil filter bypass plate? I hope so as bypassing the oil filter itself, needless to say, is very bad.

Not as bad as you may think

http://theoildrop.server101.com/cgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=3;t=000211;p=5

[ M1 filter ] [ Fram filter ]
[Blend Blend] [ Molybond Mineral ][Blend]
oil visc 15w40 15w40 15w40 15w40 15w40 5w30 5w30
miles 10,500 4,022 4,000 6,845 9442 3520 3921

Wear Metals
copper 10 19 8 10 7 4 4
iron 30 17 12 16 20 8 5
chrom 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
alum 2 2 2 2 1 2 2
lead 18 36 2 7 14 8 5

Additives
moly 121 114 99 85 78 91 95
phos 1146 709 937 716 765 980 920
zinc 1260 906 1017 786 752 862 809
magnesum 14 9 9 7 7 10 6
calc 3587 2976 2809 2228 2405 1923 1732

Contaminants
silicon 7 7 3 5 8 8 6
%antifreeze,fuel,%h20 all 0

Oil Properties
Vsic 16.65 12.81 14.49 14.82 16.37 9.51 9.95
50w 40w 40w 40w 50w 30w 30w
sulfur 4 45 15 12 14 14 33
oxidation 32 21 13 15 14 14 12
nitration 35 20 14 15 21 13 10
soot 0 0 0 0 0 0 0

no filter at ALL
5w30 blend

oil visc 5w30
miles 4,253

Wear Metals
copper 7
iron 15
chrom 1
alum 4
lead 13
Additives
moly 123
phos 876
zinc 1024
magnesum 9
calc 2198

Contaminants
silicon 12
%antifreeze,fuel,%h20 all 0

Oil Properties
Vsic 10.37
30w
sulfur 42
oxidation 13
nitration 12
soot 0

The bad stuff is in the 20 micron range, and most filters won't really get that low with any good beta levels.

http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=6;t=002793#000000

And here too. 59 Vetteman ran 7 cars for 30K miles on a bypass alone. Scroll down about 2/3 and see the adapter he used.


Second, yes, I woud be running a sandwich adapter with a motorguard TP kit

http://www.bypassfilter.com/

[Soron]

Don't know about you but I have more faith in an engine running longer with a filter than without one, however I have read that a bypass filter is just really 2 filters, 1 for large particals and the other for much smaller ones, I like this, it seems better than having a remote filter sanwhich adapter connected to a double filter, but having to buy 2 specialized filters kinda sucks unless you can use normal aftermarket oil filters up to the specs.

[blupupher]

All a bypass filter is is a low flow, high filtration filter used in addition to a regular filter.
So the regular filter still does it's normal job, while the bypass takes a lower flow and filters much, much better, making the oil last much longer (verified with a used oil analysis).

And for all the others reading this, were just a few oil nuts who spend too much time worrying about oil. Millions of cars run millions of miles using almost any oil and filter with no problems.

[Soron]

hmm I might try that, (along with an oil cooler later on) any good aftermarket brand out there?

[Cypher]

whats hte point of an oil cooler? don't say it cools the oil that much is evident... sr lists it in the performacne section how does that help

[Soron]

The cooler an oil is the longer it lasts cause it wont break down as fast due to thermal breakdown. It also helps the cooling system as the coolent does not have to work as hard to keep the engine cooled down when the oil gets cooled down as well which helps to cool the engine.

[blupupher]

hmm I might try that, (along with an oil cooler later on) any good aftermarket brand out there?

http://www.oilguard.com/

[Dust]

All a bypass filter is is a low flow, high filtration filter used in addition to a regular filter.
So the regular filter still does it's normal job, while the bypass takes a lower flow and filters much, much better, making the oil last much longer (verified with a used oil analysis).

And for all the others reading this, were just a few oil nuts who spend too much time worrying about oil. Millions of cars run millions of miles using almost any oil and filter with no problems.


I agree, now, to argue bypass filters. TP is better, it filters lower, and is cheaper. Downside, it gets changed between 3K-5K miles. FIlter setups, more expensive, filter less, change less.

I think Amsoil is the only company that offers the dual bypass setup, with one full flow and one bypass.

yes, we are oil freaks. Avoid the elves, trust the green elixir, stay away from anything but VSOT, LC, FP, and ARX, oh, and STP 4 cylinder oil extender.

I do disagree with one statement made by the oilguard website. With a particle count I think that a filter's ability can be somewhat quantified.

[blupupher]

...

yes, we are oil freaks. Avoid the elves, trust the green elixir, stay away from anything but VSOT, LC, FP, and ARX, oh, and STP 4 cylinder oil extender.
...
The Green Elixer, LOL, so few know of the work of our little German friends. You tried any yet? My car likes it. :)

[Dust]

Heard very good things about it, and knew that my GTP liked a heavy 30, but couldn't ever find it on sale enough to take the place of my $1.47 Motorcraft Syn Blend.

[blupupher]

Heard very good things about it, and knew that my GTP liked a heavy 30, but couldn't ever find it on sale enough to take the place of my $1.47 Motorcraft Syn Blend.
So it is available in Japan? Lots of different oils over there that we don't have in the states.

[Dust]

Not that I have seen. YOu don't want to know how much American OIls are over here. Lets just say that SJ 10-30 DIno starts at 2000 yen for 4 liter jug.

[mlumz]

Mobil 1 Synthetic is my oil of choice and is easily obtained at any store and isn't too expensive.

[fgummett]

OK... cost aside, my understanding is that synthetics are better for your engine : they are more fluid at lower temperatures (that is they flow freely ....providing protection to all those moving parts... as soon as you start the engine) while still maintaining the necessary thickness or viscosity at higher temperatures.. plus they do not break down as readily at those higher temperatures. They keep your engine cleaner. In some cases they may even help to reduce engine temperature and slightly increase performance (see Royal Purple and/or RedLine sites for tests).
:confused: I wonder sometimes if folks on this forum are just trying to save money or get the most out of their cars? Just 'cos an oil will last a year doesn't mean you have to live with it for a year... in my view the benefits outweigh the costs especially in the long term care of your engine ....you know you thrash it from time to time so why not baby it?!

[Dust]

I see it as wasteful.

Dumping an oil that will go 10K miles in a properly running car at 3K miles is
1. Bad for the environment
2. A waste of money
3. Bad for the car (test show reduced wear after 3K miles, filters get better as they get full)
4. A waste of time

Lets say you spend $5 a quart for oil, plus $5 on a filter, and dump it at 3K miles, even though Hyundai says you are good with dino for 7500

By 7500 miles, you would have enough money left over to get your oil tested, with a particle count, to see how your engine was running, what problems it may or may not have, and would be able to adjust your OCI, and your filter to run your oil correctly.

This "I like to pamper my car", and "I don't care what it cost", is the same reason that everyone pissed and moaned abuot soaring gas prices, but still went to the pump all the same.

WOrrying about oil shortages doesn't mean a thing unless you try to change the amount of oil you use.

[fgummett]

I agree that would be wasteful. I was responding to what I read as a large number of posts that seem to fall on the side of money saving over engine saving. In my view not a good long term attitude.
That said you might research some of the better (cost more) synthetics that have little if any "dino oil" in them at all.
I would be interested to see the studies showing that a filter and oil improve with age.. after 3K you say? That's non-intuitive to me.
I agree that it makes perfect sense to get a particle count and adjust your oil change interval based on objective factors, rather than just mileage.. I regularly check my oil level and the oil cap... in particular looking at the colour and purity.

[Soron]

filters dont get better as they get full, when they get full they switch over to bypass mode and your oil is no longer being filtered. As far as I know. there isn't a filter on the market that lasts beyond 6k (k&N/mobile1 filters), with most of the popular cheaper brands (fram) lasting only 3k.

[Dust]

filters dont get better as they get full, when they get full they switch over to bypass mode and your oil is no longer being filtered. As far as I know. there isn't a filter on the market that lasts beyond 6k (k&N/mobile1 filters), with most of the popular cheaper brands (fram) lasting only 3k.


Please show me the studies and Used Oil Analysis that you are using to base these statements one. Many people are going 5K on cheap Supertech filters without problems. BOth internally and on paper.

[Soron]

Actually I found the statement on bob is the oil guy website, it will take me awhile to re-locate the post on it, as I ran across it accidentally doing research on the m1-104 filter. it was my belief that as oil filters got full there would be a pressure increase (lack of flow) that would force it into bypass mode (pressure opens bypass valve) and the more full it got the more often it would go into bypass mode and eventually stay in bypass mode, (hence even though the oil lasts 15k, the filters dont which is why they must be changed every 3-6k) and if the oil is not being filtered at all then that cant be good for the engine. if I am misinformed on the operation of an oil filter then my bad. However what I ment about filters lasting up to 6k is based on inquiries I made to the manufacturers themselves (actually their tech support).

[blupupher]

No filter lasts that long huh? My UOA from 7500 miles with an OEM looked great. Terry said try 10k next time.
Mobil 1 says that you can go 15,000 miles on their EP filters (actualy they say no filter change is necessary with any filter). Amsoil has a 25,000 mile filter.
Strange how we can read the same site (BITOG) but get different info from it.
Filters do filter better as they get used, to a point, then they go into bypass. The problem is ther is no real way to tell if a filter is bypassing without doing a UOA.

[4mynikka]

I use to use Motul 5w30 but it's way too expensive so now I use Royal Purple and change every 8000km's or 5000 miles.

[Soron]

This is why I ask the manufactuers themselves, yes according to mobil1's website their filter lasts 15k but when I asked them for specific lifetime for an elantra they quoted me 7.5k. which happens to be the oci for the elantra (coencidence?), when I asked K&N for their filter lifetime they quoted 6k max for the elantra. Personally I think they specify 15k on m1's website so they can cover all their bases and quoted me 7.5k filter life so they wont encourage other people to invalidate warrenties doing an oil change but hey draw your own conclusions.

[blupupher]

This is why I ask the manufactuers themselves, yes according to mobil1's website their filter lasts 15k but when I asked them for specific lifetime for an elantra they quoted me 7.5k. which happens to be the oci for the elantra (coencidence?), when I asked K&N for their filter lifetime they quoted 6k max for the elantra. Personally I think they specify 15k on m1's website so they can cover all their bases and quoted me 7.5k filter life so they wont encourage other people to invalidate warrenties doing an oil change but hey draw your own conclusions.

True. If you read the fine print on EP oil and filters, they say not to excede vehicle manufacturers OCI if your in warranty still.
Remember, Hyundai says their OEM filter is built and designed to go 7500 miles in normal conditions, which I happen to meet.

[Soron]

oddly enough I tried to find the m1-104 filter here in town and the 5 stores (checker/autozone/pepboys) I visited were all out of them, will try again next week so I can find that small print, besides my oil change is comming up :)

I would not doubt hyundai designed the filter to last 7500 miles otherwise they couldent specify a 7500 mile oci, me personally I would still like to change the filter every 4-6k (using synthetic of course) with top ups just to keep the oil cleaner longer.

[FordFasteRR]

..............

Lets say you spend $5 a quart for oil, plus $5 on a filter, and dump it at 3K miles, even though Hyundai says you are good with dino for 7500
................



That is why I spend $5 PER GALLON of oil and $ 3.50 for each filter ! HA !!!

Show me one dyno that proves synthetic oil makes more power in an elantra motor....

I have yet to see any proof. If synthetic oil will give me 5 whp gain, then I might try it... otherwise, whats the f-ing point of spending more $$ on it ? LOL

If it doesn't add power, or make it more reliable, then its pointless.. Considering that I change my oil every 2000 miles religiously, synthetic has no benefits in the reliability claim.

[blupupher]

... Considering that I change my oil every 2000 miles religiously, synthetic has no benefits in the reliability claim.
If you were doing that with synthetic I would come and slap you. :D
Your 2000 mile OCI with dino is fine, just as my 7500 mile OCI with syn is fine. Different needs for different uses.

[Soron]

That is why I spend $5 PER GALLON of oil and $ 3.50 for each filter ! HA !!!

Show me one dyno that proves synthetic oil makes more power in an elantra motor....

I have yet to see any proof. If synthetic oil will give me 5 whp gain, then I might try it... otherwise, whats the f-ing point of spending more $$ on it ? LOL

If it doesn't add power, or make it more reliable, then its pointless.. Considering that I change my oil every 2000 miles religiously, synthetic has no benefits in the reliability claim.

no benefits in the reliability claim!? what about keeping the motor clean/cleaning deposits such as sludge? although 2k oil changes wont leave much sludge in your case, but there is still the fact that synthetic still provides other benefits that dino oil just can't such as faster oil flow at cold temps, better temp protection (high and low), reduced heat induced oxidation and a host of other benefits that dino oil just can't compare with.

[fgummett]

I also echo the reliability benefits of synthetic oils... especially here in the Great White North where its reassuring to know that the engine oil is flowing even with a cold start. This to me means more than an HP gain but if you insist...
Royal Purple have independent tests here that include modest HP gains in a variety of engines (among other benefits)... no... not in an Elantra and yes in most (but not all) cases they also swapped the gear oils to synthetic
http://www.royalpurple.com/techrp/summary.html

Red Line makes similar claims but does not show independent testing
http://www.redlineoil.com/products_motoroil.asp?productID=45&synthFlash=1&subcatID=14

[Kokit]

I don't know, but Russians Hyundai Dealers use Castrol GTX :confused: