In need of advice (legal / car accident)

[Rdizziedog]

I'm not sure how much of this issue I have posted about since it happened but I need some advice. I was in an accident exactly 2 weeks ago today. I was crossing the street and the lady ran into the side of me. Picture:

http://www.rdizzie.com/crash/googlecrash.jpg

Pictures of my car: http://www.rdizzie.com/crash/
(doesn't look too bad, I know)

The police officer issued me a citation for "fail to yield right of way" to the 45 year old black lady that looked extremely tired that didn't brake/swerve/honk... The first thing the cop said to me when he got out of his car was "how long you been driving?" I knew right then that I was screwed.

I gave my statement to my insurance company and they've been trying to get ahold of the lady and finally got her statement. They said she kept contradicting herself in her statement saying things like "I saw him crossing the road..." and then a few minutes later she said "I didn't see him until I hit him." My insurance company denied her claim because they said they just need 1% negligence on her part to deny it, she got pissed!

On the police report the cop put the speed in the spot where it happened as 35, and when he asked her how fast she was going, she said "35 or 40." He wrote down 35 for her. I talked to a police officer friend of mine and he said that there is a law (LINK TO LAW (http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+cod+46.2-823)) that states "The driver of any vehicle traveling at an unlawful speed shall forfeit any right-of-way which he might otherwise have under this article."

The actual speed in that zone where it happened is 25, NOT 35. She openly admitted going 10-15mph OVER the speed limit, and the police officer didn't even know the correct speed in that zone!

I know none of you are insurance agents/lawyers/judges but I just want to know what you guys think of this situation. I'm going to court and I'm definitely going to fight the ticket. It should be pretty cut and dry because of that law and now that I have proof she was speeding, I should win easily. But do I need a lawyer? How easy should it really be to get rid of the ticket?

Also, the insurance is an issue... $7024 worth of damage+labor so far on my car. My parents have a $1000 deductible for it because they wanted to keep the rates low (argh). So I have to pay the $1000 deductible, but since she openly admitted to the police officer that she was speeding (on paper 10mph over) and to my insurance agent (15mph over), shouldn't I be found not at fault now? I understood why they found me at fault before, but I never agreed with it. When she hit my car, it flew like 10 yards, spinning me around 110 degrees or so, throwing me up a curb into some grass. You don't do that kind of damage with that kind of force while going 35mph...

Can I get my deductible back? Can my insurance company change their stance on this claim now since I have new evidence proving she was pretty much 100% at fault? If she was going the speed limit, 25mph, this would have never happened because I would have had plenty of time to cross the street (all she had to do was brake for 2 seconds and it wouldn't have happened).

Thanks in advance for the help, hope you guys have some good things to say...

[evan938]

well, from the pic you posted, im going to say youre probably SOL. regardless if she was speeding or not, from the pic, it looks like there is no light there, and the road she is on is the main road. it seems like you have a stop sign to wait to go through and she doesnt. correct me if im wrong. if this is the case, she has the right away and YOU failed to yield to continuous traffic. i think if you try to argue it youre going to lose.

how many wrecks have you been in since you got this car like a year ago? 3?

[Rdizziedog]

The only other accident I've been in was when I was stopped in a line of traffic and a car ran into me from behind (I was completely stopped, they ran into me going about 20mph). I'm not sure if you were trying to take a low blow at my driving skills with that comment but this is the first accident that I've been in that has been "my fault" (which is highly debatable in my opinion).

I was stopped at a stop sign, she was stopped at a stop sign (turning out of the shopping center onto the road). I looked left, no cars, looekd right, she was stopped at the stop sign. I went, she apparently made the turn out from the stop sign, floored it, and ran right into me (4/5 of my car was already into the parking lot, she has admitted she was speeding and not paying attention...)

You said "if this is the case, she has the right away". Did you not read the law that I posted? "The driver of any vehicle traveling at an unlawful speed shall forfeit any right-of-way which he might otherwise have under this article." Since I can prove she was going at least 10mph over the speed limit, she forfeitted her right-of-way.

[evan938]

i hear what youre saying, but come on.

if youre telling me you looked up, she was where that white car is, you started to cross and she somehow sped up enough to hit you? thats a good 15+ car lenghts. probably more. she would have had to been driving a fairly fast car to even get up to speed enough to catch you as you were going by. you say
45 year old black lady
honestly, ive never seen a 45 year old lady, black, white, yellow, whatever come out of any situation where the car is stopped (light, parking lot, etc) and "floor it." i ride with my mom and some of her friends frequently and it usually takes them a couple minutes to get up to the speed limit of 35. not saying its not possible, but it seems highly unlikely

i think she was probably already on the road and you just didnt see her. i dont see any way she could have gotten enough speed to make it down there in the 3-4 seconds it would have taken you to cross the road

try pitching that law to a judge and see what he says. the law in ohio says that if an accident occurs off of a roadway, the parties involved are required to swap insurance info and no ticket can be issued. couple years ago i sneezed, reached into the glove box for a tissue, looked up and this woman was parked 1/2 way on the road blocking a entry way for a business. i swerved but ended up hittng her. when the cops came, i told them she was on the road some, but on the ticket, they showed her as being off the road over the line. when i went to the judge and pointed this out, trying to get out of the ticket, and just deal with insurance, i was told 'that doesnt mean you can just go off the road and hit someone'. i told him im not trying to avoid the whole situation and just drop the ticket since they were technically showing her as being off a roadway, it didnt fly.

and no one was insulting your driving ability, i just thought you had some other wreck recently.

[Rdizziedog]

I guess it would have been helpful if I mentioned that she is a night nurse that helps sick people out at their homes (hospis nurse?) and immediately got on the phone after it happened and started getting yelled at by the guy that she was going to take care of, apparently she was already late, hence the speeding / rushing and my assumption of her "flooring it".

She told my insurance company that she turned onto the road, so she was not already on the road.

I don't know why you thought I was in another wreck recently... I'm going to sleep.

[03SilverBullet]

The bottom line is that your insurance company and hers have the last word so by asking us for help wont make it all better. If you wanna get some advice from a insurance agent then send a PM to jeffv1970, he works with insurance im not sure what kind of insurance he deals with but its worth a try.

[Mad_Hatter]

ok i have had this same situation happen to me with a ford probe and my s-10...even though she was speeding and she had the right-of-way does not mean you were not at fault. it does not matter weather she pulled out of a parking lot and floored it or if she had been cruising down that main strech of road for 15 mins. the fact of the matter remains that you, at fault, failed to realize all of the possibilities of crossing a busy 4 lane road.

[Rdizziedog]

I asked the agent today on the phone and she said she couldn't answer these questions without further evidence (she kept avoiding answering my questions). She's sending someone to the scene to meet me on Monday to take pictures of where it happened and of the speed limit sign that says 25mph. Until then I just wanted to see what everyone else had to say about it all. I was just wondering if anyone knew more about this and could give some insight into what their final decision might come down to based on all of the given information.

ok i have had this same situation happen to me with a ford probe and my s-10...even though she was speeding and she had the right-of-way does not mean you were not at fault. it does not matter weather she pulled out of a parking lot and floored it or if she had been cruising down that main strech of road for 15 mins. the fact of the matter remains that you, at fault, failed to realize all of the possibilities of crossing a busy 4 lane road.

She was the only one on the road when it happened. No other cars came by until a good 30-40 seconds after it all happened. "busy 4 lane road" = not so much when it happened.

[Rdizziedog]

On Monday my insurance company met with me at the scene of where it happened and took pictures. They sent the pictures to the main office and got back to me yesterday. They are now finding me not at fault and they are going to arbitration with Geico. Geico doesn't know any of the new things that I've told my insurance company (proof of her speeding, point of impact, all that) so they'll go in thinking that the police report is accurate and still think all of that stuff is right, which it isn't.

I'm going to court on June 20th to fight the ticket and I talked to a cop that I know today and he said that with that law it should be really simple to get rid of the ticket. He said just go in, present the law, present the pictures showing the real speed limit, and the inaccurate police report. He said he has even lost a case because of that law before.

Hopefully my insurance company wins at arbitration!

[04GTboySC]

cool, good luck dude

[TNT4ME]

just remember...Just the facts in court. Be professional, and no matter what, don't mouth off to the judge!

[Vampyrate]

okay, i dont know about the specifics other than what you told me, but from the sounds of it, since you are so young (sorry to have to play that card) i suggest that you get a lawyer just so the court doesnt try to screw you over or any of your police officer friends that are willing to request the court date off to help defend you. pretty much any professional in this sort of field would be better than what knowledge you may or may not have about the subject.

[Tyburn]

exactly the same thing happened few months ago before I got my XD when I was driving my mom's Honda Pilot.
everything is the same except there were a lot more trafic lights (all blinking green) on the lady's (in my case, freaking Jeep guy's) way.
All I could do was getting a speeding ticket to the guy who got me T-boned at the court. Other than that, it was decided 100% my fault.
Do ya have some good witness on your side? cuz if you don't you're prolly screwed... sorry dude

[golfino]

Get a lawyer!!!!!!! No matter what anybody says, are they going to be there to help you pay for the damages?
You expect to convince another lawyer and a judge that you are not at fault by yourself??? People get lawyers for speeding tickets, From the looks of the pictures this was a mjor accident. Guaranteed the other side is going to spend a lot of money to win, they dont want to pay to fix your car.

[Vampyrate]

okay bro, in all honesty, you will be the only one there with a lawyer, if not, it will be you , a judge, and a cop. that how it was for my car and it was about the same seriousness as yours, though i was at fault. the ***** i hit didnt even show up

[Rdizziedog]

I spoke with the clerk at the juvenile court today and she said the other party (the lady) doesn’t even attend the meeting at the court. It's just me, one of my parents, the judge, and the officer, and any legal representation if we choose to get some. The only thing I have to do is lay out the facts to the judge, show that the cop wrote down the wrong speed, showing that she was speeding 10-15mph over the limit, then show her the law that says I shouldn't have got the ticket, if needed show cases where this has happened before, show the pictures, and it should be fairly easy. Also, my insurance is sending me papers in the mail to bring with me to further help convince the judge. The papers are going to say that they have changed their decision after investigation and that I'm no longer at fault, etc. I plan to dress very professional and anyone that knows me knows that I am very articulate when needed.

[Vampyrate]

take a picture of the speed limit sign of that street and if its away from the street sign naming the street, that too... that will help you out more than you think. also take pics of any tire marks on teh ground if theyre still there

[Rdizziedog]

take a picture of the speed limit sign of that street and if its away from the street sign naming the street, that too... that will help you out more than you think. also take pics of any tire marks on teh ground if theyre still there

Already have the pictures taken, plus the insurance company is going to send me a CD in the mail with all of the photos they took, just incase the judge doesn't believe my photos.

There weren't any tire marks on the ground because she didn't even brake when she hit me. She didn't brake. She admitted to my insurance company something like "I didn't even see him until I hit him" (they have it recorded, but can't release it to me for privacy issues or something blah blah, I'd really like to take that to court too though).

[Vampyrate]

what you can do is if you have a lawyer have them try to release it to them, or talk the ins. company to release it to the judge directly. and that is good that you have so many pics as well. and im sure if the judge knows basic math that 110 degree turn after a t-bone @ 35 or so mph is not possible unless you have bald tires, and from the looks of your pics, they look fairly new, if not brand new.

[Doohickie]

honestly, ive never seen a 45 year old lady, black, white, yellow, whatever come out of any situation where the car is stopped (light, parking lot, etc) and "floor it." You need to ride with my wife sometime. Seriously. Oh, and my 70-year-old mom too. She's what I call a "binary driver"; she's either fully on the gas or fully on the brake.

[Rdizziedog]

what you can do is if you have a lawyer have them try to release it to them, or talk the ins. company to release it to the judge directly. and that is good that you have so many pics as well. and im sure if the judge knows basic math that 110 degree turn after a t-bone @ 35 or so mph is not possible unless you have bald tires, and from the looks of your pics, they look fairly new, if not brand new.

Good thinking about releasing it to the judge only, but they said the only way they could give it out is if the info was subpoenaed :(

Yeah, I'm hoping the judge isn't one of those people that automatically condemn kids... heh, also I hope he/she has a little bit of common sense! My tires were fairly new, my car only had something like 4500 miles on it!

Total damage (with labor): $7028.14

[Vampyrate]

most juve judges are dicks because they see badass kids all the time that have no respect for the law, you will wow them bro... ive only met you once, but you are wise beyond your years in my view.

when i was waiting for my case, i saw a guy up on 5 felony counts of possession, it was insane!

[Rdizziedog]

most juve judges are dicks because they see badass kids all the time that have no respect for the law, you will wow them bro... ive only met you once, but you are wise beyond your years in my view.

when i was waiting for my case, i saw a guy up on 5 felony counts of possession, it was insane!

Thanks for the compliemnt, that's what I'm hoping for!

5 felony counts of possession? Damn, that's pretty hardcore, I WISH I was that hardcore!

[Vampyrate]

he was twitching up a storm in the court room and had to be no more than a day over 18... crazy SWeVA kids and their meth!

[DeepWaterBlue]

Let this be a painful lesson for everyone here....

NEVER, EVER, talk to your insurance company without consulting with an attorney first.......especially if you were cited or charged with anything.

I suspect your parents will foot a rather large bill, and worse than that, your car insurance rates for the next decade will be out of rhelm of reality.

[Rdizziedog]

Let this be a painful lesson for everyone here....

NEVER, EVER, talk to your insurance company without consulting with an attorney first.......especially if you were cited or charged with anything.

I suspect your parents will foot a rather large bill, and worse than that, your car insurance rates for the next decade will be out of rhelm of reality.

More like *I* am stuck with a rather large bill ($1000 deductible), and since my parents have been with the same insurance company for something like 25 years and have had only two small accidents, the rates wont go up. Since the ticket should be going away and since my insurance company is not finding me at fault anymore, my future insurance shouldn't be effected at all.

[DeepWaterBlue]

More like *I* am stuck with a rather large bill ($1000 deductible), and since my parents have been with the same insurance company for something like 25 years and have had only two small accidents, the rates wont go up. Since the ticket should be going away and since my insurance company is not finding me at fault anymore, my future insurance shouldn't be effected at all.


I hate to sound like a skeptic....but don't trust your insurance company or anything they say until this case is settled. They have been known in the past to tell customers they were waiving fault only to get them to talk more and rescind their decision. Not saying yours is, I'm just saying be careful. Less is more.

[Tyburn]

at least you guys are lucky down at the states, here in Canada, ESPECIALLY in this freakin BC got just ONE damn insurance company. it is called ICBC. there ain't no other insurance company at all in entire BC.
they are like hitlers over here, if they don't like you, they won't pay a single penny and make YOU pay for dumping your car.
If you are like 60 years old and had paid money all your life to them, you get this so called "Golden Driver" title while I have "beginner" title because I just started paying them.

[Leviathant]

Heh. Your insurance company is not your friend. They want your money, and more of it.


It is VERY importance that you are coordial, courteous and well-spoken at your court date. Make sure your documentation is well-prepared, or the judge won't even want to see it.

Only present evidence that you physically have -- if you mention that the lady told the insurance company this-or-that, but that you don't have a tape of it, you are just wasting the judges time.

This sounds seriously corny, but watch a few episodes of Law & Order and listen to how they address judges. "Yes, your honor" and "Thank you, your honor" and the like.

Go to the Salvation Army and pick up a suit for $8 while you're at it.

Every little bit counts :)