Heel-Toe Driving

[waif69]

OK, I have been trying to figure this out for a while now, what exactly is is heel-toe driving. I have tried to put my heel on the gas and toe on the brake with the left foot on the clutch, I even reversed my right foot.
I just don't get it. :drive:

[jayupark]

You can get pedal covers to make it a bit easier... I learned how to Heel Toe before I could start the car off the line properly...

I find using the ball of your foot and rolling it across the brake and the acc to be the easiest way. Just look it up online.

Be safe :D

[fgummett]

it's not exactly easy... especially on the Elantra where I find the gap between the pedals is too wide. The idea (as I'm sure you know) is that during a down-shift you want to blip the gas to bring the engine speed up to match the clutch... often the term is a misnomer as many drivers actually just roll the outside edge of the Right foot off the brake pedal and onto the accelerator... as I said not easy on our cars. Others keep the ball of the foot on the brake and swing the heel over the gas. Bottom line is that it takes practice to get it smooth... probably not something to try on a busy street. Good Luck

[SWortham]

Yeah, it's not the best thing to practice on the street. With the Elantra it helps to have wide feet. The pedal placement isn't ideal for heel-toe shifting but it isn't too bad. I was doing it at Motorsport Ranch but it was hard to be smooth about it. It really takes a lot of practice.

[BobMs_wht2k2]

With 12EEEE It's not so hard. . . . after 4 years it's become second nature.

[SWortham]

Probably the only time you'd need to do it is with high speed road racing. There's usually no point in autocrossing because you can drive most courses in 2nd.

But for road racing the idea is to brake, downshift, turn-in, and then let off the brake smoothly, apply gas smoothly, and let out the clutch smoothly all at the same time to match revs at the apex and power out of the corner. It's a lot to do in a very short period of time.

[fgummett]

...the idea is to brake, downshift, turn-in, and then let off the brake smoothly, apply gas smoothly, and let out the clutch smoothly all at the same time to match revs at the apex and power out of the corner. It's a lot to do in a very short period of time.it does sound like a lot when you put it like that... but its amazing what your feet get skilled at with practice (practice... practice...) I'm not saying I've got the heel-toe thing going but just a quick smooth downshift without really thinking it through is quite a feat :D

[waif69]

thanks all! I am thinking about getting back into autocross since I got the elantra, it is almost as much fun as my camaro I used to have and it doesn't attract the 5-oh as much.

[BobMs_wht2k2]

Of course the feeling of getting it right is amazing. That sensation when you come down from 80 do 2 down shifts with perfect rev-match and then turn in on a 90-deg left hander and apply throttle slowly until you're WOT and the car starts to push the nose just a bit and you hear the tires scrambling for traction as you exit that 25mph corner at 50 and then shift to 3rd. . . . the feeling is exhilerating.

[A&F 01 GLS]

if you can't do heel-toe there is a device (expensive) that is push button operated and it does it for you... There is a Porsche driver i believe that broke his foot and can't roll his heels so he has to do it by hand. Just adds a nice engine rev every time he slows down to a corner..... sounds pretty cool

[Jonny666]

Probably the only time you'd need to do it is with high speed road racing. There's usually no point in autocrossing because you can drive most courses in 2nd.

But for road racing the idea is to brake, downshift, turn-in, and then let off the brake smoothly, apply gas smoothly, and let out the clutch smoothly all at the same time to match revs at the apex and power out of the corner. It's a lot to do in a very short period of time.

^that's not 100% correct^
you want to brake and downshift at the same time and be in the correct gear before you even enter the corner with the clutch out.
in order to understand heel toe ya have to start with the double clutch.
Here's why you do it:
SYNCHRO'S
What do synchro's do? simply put they match the speed of the input and output shaft in your transmission when you change gears so that the dog teeth can engage smoothly.
Fact#1 synchro's are slow!
a correct double clutch downshift is nearly instant. when ya get it just right the shifter slides into gear like a hot knife thru butter. it almost feels like the shifter gets sucked into gear and its extreamly fast. if you try the same downshift using the synchro's it would take 3 or 4 times as long.
fact#2 synchro's are weak
the 2 weakest links in a manual transmission are generally the clutch and the synchro's. synchro's are generally made of soft metal like brass. that means they wear out. if you work em hard and shift as hard and fast as you can all the time they're gonna wear out FAST.
so here's the idea behind double clutching.
assuming your crusing down the highway at 3000rpm in 5th gear and you want to get out and pass the car in front of you but they'res no power in 5th at 3000 rpm. you want the be in 3rd gear (yes you can skip 4th) so you:
1) push in the clutch
2) take the stick out of gear
3) let the clutch back in (why would i take the clutch out? i dont get it??? keep reading)
4) "blip" the motor to match the your speed in 3rd gear (lets assume is roughly 4500rpm)
5) put in the clutch
6) slide the stick into 3rd gear like a hot knife thru melted butter
7) dump the clutch like its hot (if you've done your blip right its already matched up and it should be smoother than glass)
all this happens in a fraction of a seccond.
if you simply push in the clutch and rev the motor then jam it into 3rd you have effectivly matched the speed of the flywheel to the speed of the output shaft in your transmission. (the problem with that is?) the speed of the imput shaft on the transmission is matched to 5th gear. that means your not really doing anything at all. when you follow the above sequence you match the speed of the input and output shafts in your transmission. This eleminates the need for the slow/weak syncrho's.
heel toe shifting is doing the above while braking before a corner. the reason for this is 4 fold. 1 your instantly in the right gear for the corner and there is no difficult clutch ease out in the middle of your corner. 2 the power is there and ready to rock as soon as you want it in the corner. 3 done right its soooo smooth you wouldnt even know a shift happened even on a solid disk race clutch. 4 engin brake helps you slow down without overworking your brakes.
I like to use the very top of my foot on the brake and you roll whole right half of your foot over to the gas to blip it. that is all

[SWortham]

That makes sense. I've never been properly taught this technique. I thought I had it figured out from watching other drivers. But the way you describe it does seem like the better way to do it.

[BobMs_wht2k2]

I skip the double clutching part, but the rest is right on the money. Have to try DC to see if it really is any smoother for me.

[only1db]

um...i'm not feeling the double clutch...i have tried it...but all of that stopped back in the 50's when bmw came out with the syncro...by the way...you can have your syncros cryo frozen...and they will be golden for just about forever...same with the gears.

heel toe is an everyday thing for me....as i like to drive hard...roads around my way have corners all over the place...and to be smooth you have to heel toe.

i just simply roll my foot over to the gas...i find that some sneakers are better than others just becuase they are a little wider...the pedals are a little too wide for this but it can be done.

[LateAPXR]

^ I'm with him...I use it daily to drive around town. Makes EVERY downshift I do even if I' m not pushing the car a smoother downshift.

Easier on the tranny/clutch too.

[only1db]

only time i dont is when i need the engine to help brake...or if i'm slowing down anyway.

[Jonny666]

I've found that its easyer the harder your pressing on the brake pedal as this moves the brake pedal closer to the gas. unfortunaly this sux for learing.

[waif69]

It seems like a lot of practice is in order.

[only1db]

^ thats because there is....its not something you learn overnight...

[TURBOgls]

heres some heel toe action for ya! (http://videos.streetfire.net/video/c8710573-fd48-4c11-8a2f-80db3f41d4d1.htm)

[fgummett]

^^ excellent find... watch that left foot pumping out the double-clutching as well! I got some practicing to do... :bowdown:

[BlackElantraGT]

heres some heel toe action for ya! (http://videos.streetfire.net/video/c8710573-fd48-4c11-8a2f-80db3f41d4d1.htm)

LOL I was just about to post that after I had clicked on the link with the Saudi drifting on his bike.

[TURBOgls]

lol. that video(saudi bike drifting) is all over the place. myspace, google, streetfire, EVERYWERE!!

[jalmir]

Wow that vid shows great technique!

Though I hate streetfire for the comments (which I don't read anymore :P) some are posting crappy comments you just can't beleive someone can be that dumb!!! I'm sure you will find ppl saying he's not that good in the comments! ;)

[waif69]

I have been trying to practice, however on the street it is rather impractical, or not possible when in traffic (like all the time in NJ).

wow, that is a great video. I think it will be a long time before I can do it that well. I don't even double clutch that well, not even close... someday. I guess I have to get back with the SCCA.

[only1db]

damn thing...i hate dial up...it buffers...and then i hear it...but the video is all choppy! i want ot see it damn it!!!

i cant wait till i can get to skip barber.

[Jonny666]

the best idea is to learn to double clutch first in several differant gears.
once you have that smooth as glass then you want to park your car and practice going thru the motions while you are not moving so you dont kill anyone. then head for a totally empty parking lot in the middle of the night where you wont bother anyone and just cruse around practicng in a strait line away from anything you could hit. nice and slow, just work on being smooth and deliberate with your actions. Your foot WILL slip off the brake once in a while while you are learning its gonna happen and you will probably grind a gear or 2 but it'll b worth it.