Let's Diagnose the 12 CEL..... [Archive] - ElantraXD.com - Dedicated to the true Elantra Enthusiast

toymachine566

01-29-2007, 07:57 PM

Well after the recent problems I've been having I decided to go and buy an OBDII scanner to check my CEL. Here they are (in the order I got them in)

P0101 - Mass or Volume Circuit Range Performance Problem

P2270 - :confused: (not in the book)

P0121 - Throttle/Pedal Position Sensor/Switch A Circuit Range/Perfomance Problem

P0420 - Catalyst System Efficiency Below Threshold (Bank 1)

P0102 - Mass or Volume Circuit low input

P0170 - Fuel Trim Malfunction (Bank 1)

P0507 - Idle Control System RPM Higher than Expected

P0303 - Cylinder 3 Misfire detected

I said 12 but a couple were given twice. Now I had a CEL for a while and this weekend I decided to clean my MAF sensor and air filter......in case any of the codes have to do with that. And the misfire i just got tonight.

So anybody wanna take a stab at it and tell me what I need to fix :confused:
Thanks.

(You non-turbo guys still wanna go turbo ;) lol j/k)

EDIT: FYI - the codes were read WITH the car running. The manual says to check the codes when its not running. I did that and only ended up with ten codes.........if it makes a difference

Rystibby04

01-29-2007, 08:25 PM

well the cylinder misfire would prolly be bad stock wires...its been time for you to upgrade them...my stock ones misfired i can get mangistars dirt cheap if you want a set though i use them...and a few CEL's i have with my turbo

toymachine566

01-29-2007, 08:34 PM

I'll have to see if the head I'm looking at comes with them. I'll let you know

05xd

01-29-2007, 08:37 PM

P0101 - Mass or Volume Circuit Range Performance Problem= MAF sensor dirty more than likely

P2270 - (not in the book)

P0121 - Throttle/Pedal Position Sensor/Switch A Circuit Range/Perfomance Problem=TPS sensor.Any drivability problems? Bucking,no power,ect?

P0420 - Catalyst System Efficiency Below Threshold (Bank 1)=No cat before 2nd o2

P0102 - Mass or Volume Circuit low input=Same as first code.Dirty Maf

P0170 - Fuel Trim Malfunction (Bank 1)=Lean code I believe.May be turbo induced

P0507 - Idle Control System RPM Higher than Expected=IAC valve.Turbo induced probably.Does your idle hang really high at idle?If not no biggie.May have got something lodged in the IAC motor.Has happened to my buddy's car and cleared itself up

P0303 - Cylinder 3 Misfire detected=You know what that one is

Munky

01-29-2007, 08:41 PM

I have all known CEL's listed here (http://forum.crookedh.com/showthread.php?t=1269) if you're interested.

toymachine566

01-29-2007, 08:45 PM

wow...thanks 05.

as for the p0121, I only get maybe a surge or 2 on the highway, but randomly

the p0507, the idle doesn't hang high at idle, stays at roughly 900

Thanks Munky, The only I still cant find anywhere is the P2270

I'm just looking for what they mean and how to fix them, but if they are as 05xd said and most are just the dirty MAF then that def. takes a load off my chest

Munky

01-29-2007, 08:46 PM

P2270 = Rear HO2S signal stuck lean ON 2 HO2S

No idea what it means, but that's what I found.

toymachine566

01-29-2007, 08:47 PM

Awsome, thanks.....where did you find it?

Now hopefully someone can translate. lol

Munky

01-29-2007, 08:48 PM

I googled it, and checked about 4 different hits, all said the same thing.

05xd

01-29-2007, 08:50 PM

toymachine566

01-29-2007, 08:53 PM

yup, thats what got me too. I mean you wouldnt be able to tell anything was wrong by just driving it. It boosts really hard. But now I'm afraid to even take it to the stop sign.

You think the car is driveable the way it is or sould I be taking the wifes car to work?

vsolo

01-29-2007, 08:56 PM

OK how many miles ?

First thing, reset the the CEL & lets see what comes back...

P0303 - Cylinder 3 Misfire detected --- Could be a loose wire, try pushing them back on (let's go with the simple fixes first. (& I had this before)

P2270 - (not in the book) ok look on line, Google Search "ODBII P2270" , you sorta have read into them, sometimes you will find it in another cars problems. on a Ford site they have "P2270 O2 Sens Signal Stuck Lean bank1 Sens2"
Same info on a Dodge site.

now the accent I have has "hickups" every once in a while & has a "P1529"

Which means nothing more than the TCM (transmission control module) has requested that the ECM (engine control module) turn on the check engine lamp. All I can tell you based on this information is that the TCM has seen something abnormal. To find out what abnormal condition the TCM saw, you'd need to retrieve the DTCs (diagnostic trouble codes) from the TCM. The most frequent culprit is either the input or output speed sensor, but there's no way to know whether they may be the issue without the TCM DTCs.

you also have 2 "Bank 1" problems.... plus the other one that we found on the dodge/ford site...

Let's know what you find.. we all can learn with this.

toymachine566

01-29-2007, 09:04 PM

I have just hit 52,800

Thats what I was thinking too, I cleared the codes to see which ones are actually in effect since cleaning the MAF and air filter.

05xd

01-29-2007, 09:04 PM

Yea,reset the codes and see exactly which ones if any come back.Then go from there

toymachine566

01-29-2007, 09:19 PM

So then I shouldn't be too worried about taking it to/from work?

05xd

01-29-2007, 09:27 PM

just take it easy for a little while and see how its goes

TSmooth8403

01-29-2007, 09:53 PM

be careful with the #3 misfire, I had that one too, and replaced wires and plugs. next thing you know the piston rings went and caused scaring of the cylinder wall and even ovaled it a bit.

KeWLKaT

01-29-2007, 10:26 PM

definately not normal man, if it helps any, I am not throwing any codes at all ;)

wow...

So.. yeah...

Do the wiring for the second oxygen sensor AND

I had a vacuum leak the other day it was actually the line that connects to the unichip that was off... i would double check everything

05xd

01-29-2007, 10:37 PM

Shiz,I get some codes from time to time.Esp before I had my exhaust done,I was throwing a misfire code at least once a week.That was with new plugs as well.I think maybe the uni-chip has it's moments every once and awhile.I dunno

KeWLKaT

01-29-2007, 10:39 PM

rofl i guess its the cvvt after all :rolleyes:

05xd

01-29-2007, 10:40 PM

lol,mine loves the boost,whatchu talkin bout

KeWLKaT

01-29-2007, 10:58 PM

http://members.cox.net/pimpbot9000/roflcopter.gif

toymachine566

01-29-2007, 11:42 PM

lol.....Well, I'll see how it goes tomorrow, If I dont sign on at all then you'll know if I got stuck somewhere LOL

KeWLKaT

01-29-2007, 11:44 PM

at worse just keep you lollerskates close...

http://members.cox.net/pimpbot9000/lollerskates.gif

toymachine566

01-30-2007, 10:23 AM

^hahahahaha.

Well, I cleared the codes last night. The ride to work seemed fine. I was a little afraid to get on it, but after a while I did a small 10 psi run, still got some of the slight "surging" around 9-10 mph (x10) :D .

About the "Bank 1" codes, I was talking to Derek last night about it and we firgured that the first 02 sensor could be shot. Do you guys think that is the case also? I need to have all parts on hand by this weekend if wanna make it to work on Monday.

Cypher

01-30-2007, 01:10 PM

toymachine566

01-30-2007, 02:04 PM

my second 02 is hooked up and relocated. It worked fine with the stock cat, but I've since installed a hi-flow cat.

KeWLKaT

01-30-2007, 02:05 PM

wrong. you only have one bank. the "bank" it refers to is the cylinder. if you had a v6 one side would be bank one and the other bank 2. its because your second o2 isn't hooked up OR you don't have a cat in there. whicheve.r

ok so explain to me why i was getting bank 2 code before I did the second oxygen sensor wiring, and then POOF it was gone as soon as I did the wiring... :confused:

Cypher

01-30-2007, 05:37 PM

thats odd. lol GENERALLY most cars have bank 1 and 2s are cars with the V6s and v8s. for instance: on my ranger: when looking at the engine from the front the left side is bank one (cylinder 1,3 and 5) and the other side is bank 2 (cylinder 2,4 and 6). thats how its able to differentiate when things go wrong with its o2 sensors. i guess with the Inline motors they use the bank to differentiate between the upstream and downstream o2s.

i guess it could be that your sensor is gone.

toymachine566

01-30-2007, 07:52 PM

thats what I was thinking since isnt the first 02 the one the is more important for supplying fuel or something. And it would make sense then that the "Fuel trim Malfunction Bank 1" CEL is on the same time the catalyst one is on bothstating "Bank 1". I guess to play it safe I will swap that out as well

Well, after roughly 100 miles (to/from work), here are the codes that came back (5)....+ a new one:

P0420 - Catalyst System Efficiency Below Threshold (Bank 1) - got this one twice

P0111 - Intake Air Temperature Circuit Range/Performance Problem

P0121 - Throttle/Pedal Position Sensor/Switch A Circuit Range/Performance Problem - I still don't understand this one

P0101 - Mass or Volume Circuit Range Performance Problem

Any Ideas on where to troubleshoot? Like for the Maf, would I get that CEL from a dirty MAF or could the wiring ave gotten fubared?

And the intake air temerature one, where would I look for this one? MAF related also?

KeWLKaT

01-30-2007, 08:19 PM

from my understanding the IAT sensor is inside the MAF? Is this possible?

I know the MAP on our cars does pressure and temp, so it could be possible.

therefore it could be 2-3 codes related to the MAF

toymachine566

01-30-2007, 08:32 PM

Keyan

01-30-2007, 11:52 PM

It could be...... you know that milk chocolatey crap that we get in the catch can, well mine got full and overflowed into my inatke pipe and it ran down into my MAF. When I took it out it was COVERED in that crap. I sprayed it with electrical cleaner but it looks like I'll have to hit it with that stuff a second time. It looked like all of it came off, but maybe the residue is still a little coated on there. Sound about right?

Definately sounds like a MAF problem, i hope you didn't screw it up with electrical cleaner tho...there is a company that makes a special maf sensor cleaner that is guarenteed not to burn the maf up. look into it....

Hell if all else fails go to like Harry's U-Pull-It and pick up another MAF :)

KeWLKaT

01-30-2007, 11:54 PM

It could be...... you know that milk chocolatey crap that we get in the catch can, well mine got full and overflowed into my inatke pipe and it ran down into my MAF. When I took it out it was COVERED in that crap. I sprayed it with electrical cleaner but it looks like I'll have to hit it with that stuff a second time. It looked like all of it came off, but maybe the residue is still a little coated on there. Sound about right?

hahahahhaha

thats EXACTLY why my intake pipe doesnt have the PCV return line going to it :abovelol:

toymachine566

02-01-2007, 03:03 PM

P0121 - Throttle/Pedal Position Sensor/Switch A Circuit Range/Performance Problem - I still don't understand this one

Anyone have an idea on this code?

Estopatitiana

02-01-2007, 04:26 PM

i have the exact same code, replace the tps sensor in your case(im sure but not 100%), but in my case im screwed because my bbtb shaft was milled at a different angle than stock

UNLESS you have a wire spliced into your signal wire for the tps, that might cause some problems too, and if it is not that then i would love to hear what else it could be from someone else

Rystibby04

02-01-2007, 10:26 PM

hows the head coming? u might want girls to help not guys with it this weekend

toymachine566

02-01-2007, 10:39 PM

:smileyr: or :drive: .................. :ssst:

:whisper: :eclipsee_

i have the exact same code, replace the tps sensor in your case(im sure but not 100%), but in my case im screwed because my bbtb shaft was milled at a different angle than stock

UNLESS you have a wire spliced into your signal wire for the tps, that might cause some problems too, and if it is not that then i would love to hear what else it could be from someone else
I unplugged this it looked fine. Would this affect driveability or driving w/ this CEL mess anything up ?

Estopatitiana

02-01-2007, 11:49 PM

with mine yes, it causes the tranny to downshift randomly and will ride around at 4k rpms whene im not even hitting the throttle, but since you have a 5 speed it might cause it to idle a little higher..i havent noticed it affecting my gas mileage...thats all i can think of..if it idles high i would replace it

only1db

02-02-2007, 08:01 AM

ish...if it were broke...the car would run like ****....it would not know where the throttle body is and would now know how much fuel to add...(it works with all the other sensors includeing 02, crank postion sensor, cam position sensor and others...

you had to splice into that with the unichip didnt you?? that may be your problem.

i think that really needs to get redone and soldered and all that good stuff.

toymachine566

02-02-2007, 10:16 AM

you had to splice into that with the unichip didnt you?? that may be your problem.
I has to splice the unichip into the crank postion sensor.

i think that really needs to get redone and soldered and all that good stuff.
I totally agree though. I've been thinking the same thing, expecially while everything is out of the way.

I got a new 02 sensor from the dealership but when I opened it up it was the wrong one. I think he gave me the second 02 sensor :rolleyes:

toymachine566

02-02-2007, 07:42 PM

Well, towards the last 2-3 miles on the way home the car stalled twice. Once when I was stopping to enter my community, but I wasnt sure if it was just because I was slidiing in the snow and not hitting the clutch pedal on time. Then again pulling into my driveway, again sliding. I thought it was nothing. Then i go to read the codes and get this one:

P0123 - Throttle/Pedal Position Sensor/Switch A Circuit High Input

Can anyone elaborate? Estopatitiana?

I'm guessing TPS as well. I will be replacing that also tomorrow. Anything that throws a code form here on out will get replaced ASAP so I dont spend all of my free time here on the computer or under/over the car.

Estopatitiana

02-02-2007, 08:03 PM

ive never had that one but i would replace the tps, how many miles are on your car??

but im pretty sure its the tps...... overhaul that little bastard
i know if you dont replace the tps soon enough all the wierd idling might lead to your idle speed actuator crapping out, wich happned to me..yeah my car is like an archive of cels...it doesnt idle rough does it?

toymachine566

02-02-2007, 08:10 PM

For the few minutes that I left it running it was a little rough. Idling a little below what it normally does. Without looking at the speedo I dont remember but If normal Idle is like 900 then it was maybe 870-880. But thats about it. I went under the hood just to check to make sure it didnt come loose or something and ended up pulling it so the car turned off and I havent started it since.

Maybe I'll take a drive to the gas station or something and check it out again.

Ohh, and I'm at 53,200 (somewhere thereabouts)

toymachine566

02-03-2007, 08:02 PM

Well, I replaced the 02 sensor and the TPS and now I'm only down to 1 CEL :D........and that is the MAF one. So looks like I'll try cleaning it up and we will be re-doing the wiring as well.

Thanks for the help guys :)

Estopatitiana

02-03-2007, 08:41 PM

good to hear!!

only1db

02-04-2007, 10:13 AM

i'm not standing out there in 20 degree weather again...just for the wiring!!! hahah...spring time...or atleast a 50 degree day...

to be honest...i think the wiring has some things to do with the cels...and the fuel being spit into the tps...

toymachine566

02-04-2007, 12:07 PM

Nah, the wiring can be gotten to with the head in the car, so that can wait.

Cypher

02-05-2007, 07:58 PM

if you had a wideband and an egt i'd say just unplug the maf. the computer may be able to figure things out with it unplugged using the tps sensor and all the other sensors. it just wouldn't run open loop and run off presets.

toymachine566

02-13-2007, 09:06 PM

well after the head swap and new TPS / 02 sensor I am getting these codes: (after roughly 100
miles)

P0420 - Catalyst System Efficiency Below Threshold (Bank 1)
P0121 - Throttle/Pedal Position Sensor/Switch A Circuit Range/Performance Problem
P0101 - Mass or Volume Circuit Range Performance Problem
P0102 - Mass or Volume Circuit low input

I will be replacing the MAF soon, but could that also cause the first 2 CEL? especially since the TPS and 02 sensor are BRAND NEW :confused:

05xd

02-13-2007, 09:11 PM

The first code p0420 is due to you not having a cat.I had the same problem until I put 2 sparkplug non foulers on the 2nd o2 sensor.It pulls the o2 up enough that it's not reading all of the unburnt fuel and causing that code.I'll find the P/N for you

toymachine566

02-13-2007, 09:12 PM

awsome, thats what I was hoping. Thanks

05xd

02-13-2007, 09:21 PM

Here read this.It tells you what to do to it as well.You have to drill one out to fit the tip of the o2 but you'll see that in this thread

http://www.newtiburon.com/forums/showthread.php?t=64597&highlight=foulers

You can get them at autozone or what ever parts store you have for like 8 bucks

only1db

02-14-2007, 12:45 PM

you should get a wideband so we can check the A/F ratio at the dyno...

Cypher

02-14-2007, 01:10 PM

ummm the dyno you go to should have an o2 sensor they hook up to ur exhaust. whether you have a bung or not. i got mine when i dynoed.

toymachine566

02-14-2007, 03:17 PM

the guy said I needed a bung for their 02 meter. The other option was shoving it in the tailpipe, but that would not give an accurate reading considering the exhaust gases would have already passed through the cat.

Cypher

02-15-2007, 03:16 PM

well an inaccurate reading is better than none right?

KeWLKaT

02-15-2007, 05:52 PM

well an inaccurate reading is better than none right?

yeah im going to put the tailpipe sniffer whenever I dyno mine, I ain tgonna put a bung just for one run since im not really doing any tuning anyhow lol

toymachine566

02-15-2007, 05:56 PM

Sounds good to me........I'll do that, I may have my next dyno by next weekend if I get my MAF and Valve cover by sometime during next week.

CEL's are gone for now, maybe it was just taking time to adjust to the new equipment who knows lol

Feels good to have my baby running normal again :D (somewhat)