Need Help!

[Codenomics]

My mother in law owns the biggest piece of **** car!
2001 Pontiac GrandAm GT
It started over heating today, the car started sputtering and my wife turned it off, she waited 10 minutes and it would start. Later it started and then she ran the heater trying to cool it a lil bit. This filled the car with the smell of coolant.
There is very little coolant in the resevoir and what is in there looks like curdled milk.
I cant see any coolant in the valve cover or on the dipstick.
any ideas on what im looking at here?
Need any more info?
What should i look at closer to diagnose?

[KeWLKaT]

Blown head gasket.

[Codenomics]

thats what i thought but no coolant in the oil...........

[KeWLKaT]

Yeah but how do you explain the oil in the coolant? lol

Plus, the dipstick doesnt pick up the water easily, it picks up oil better (more viscosity). The only way to know if there is no coolant in the oil is to drain it. Which you didnt do.

Plus you're saying that it was overheating. I mean, 1+1=2, right?

Check the oil, but I guarantee you a blown HG.

[Codenomics]

I was pretty sure it was a blown head gasket.
i wasnt sure that the curdled coolant was oil, thought it might be something else. Didnt know what, but was trying to cover my bases.
I am still learning as i go here.

[KeWLKaT]

Drain the oil, it will tell you definitely. Something whack in the coolant can't be anything else unless your mil filled up the oil in the coolant spot.

[DJ Hellfire]

These cars are notorious for the lower intake manifold gasket leaking if you have the V6. I do at least 2 of these per month at work and it pays well. Due to the sputtering you described, it's likely that it has been leaking for a while and you mother cooked the engine. But the smell of coolant blowing through your vents with the blower on usually indicates a leaky heater core. But for a leaky heater core to cause any engine damage, you'd have to have some serious coolant on your front carpet.

Sounds like 3 possible issues:
*Lower intake gasket
*Leaky heater core
*Head/engine damage due to prolonged over-heating.

Take a good flash light and look down at both sides of the lower intake manifold. On the passenger side, you'll be looking down behind the power steering pump where you will see some wires coming out of the block between the two heads. This is the cam sensor. If this area is wet or has orange coolant, your lower intake is leaking. Now go on the drivers side and look down at the lower intake arear behind the t-stat and under the throttle body. It's easier to look on the side of the throttle body closer to the firewall than the side closer to the radiator. If this is wet or you clearly see orange coolant, the lower intake is leaking. This will cost you at least $400-600 to repair depending on what shop does it.

Now go under the dash and feel the carpet. If it's wet, your heater core is leaking. If not, it could still have a slight leak.

Honestly, with the sputtering, it sounds like the engine may have been cooked. It's really no way to tell without first fixing the leak and then see how the engine runs after.

Yeah but how do you explain the oil in the coolant? lol



The way the lower intake gasket is designed on these cars (crap design btw), both oil and coolant go through the gaskets. So when they break, it's not uncommon for them to mix a bit.

Drain the oil, it will tell you definitely.

Not all the time. Sometimes a blown HG will blow exhaust gas into the coolant system which will cause the coolant to appear to be boiling and will overheat due to the continuous air being puffed into the coolant system. Also, sometimes coolant will leak into the combustion chamber and burn and run like crap without mixing with the oil. It get's tricky sometimes.

[KeWLKaT]

Yeah but puffing smoke isnt a symptom he described...

That's very odd that they have both oil and coolant going through the intake gasket!!!! Wow, go GM go lol

[DJ Hellfire]

As for the curdled looking coolant, it's most likely just rust build up due to the coolant never being changed. Coolant is corrosive and get's more corrosive as it ages. So when you don't change it, it's rots away the radiator, heater core, hoses, and pretty much all metal it touches. Then the rotted metal turns to rust and creates leaks and very rusty looking coolant. Most coolant leaks can be prevented just by replacing your coolant at the specified intervals!

Yeah but puffing smoke isnt a symptom he described...

That's very odd that they have both oil and coolant going through the intake gasket!!!! Wow, go GM go lol


Well that was just an example. But the exhaust gas blowing into the coolant system example wouldn't cause any abnormal smoking, just over heating and crappy running. It's possibly a head gasket, just not guaranteed an oil drain will show it.

And yeah, the gasket design is horrible. Almost ever GM with the 3100, 3400, 3600 or 3800 V6 that comes in has a leaking lower intake, especially the ones with coolant system complaints.

[Codenomics]

ok no sputtering, it was just the road, i was wrong.
I wasnt driving my wife was, she was describing it to me.

[DJ Hellfire]

http://www.geocities.com/gm_intake/

ok no sputtering, it was just the road, i was wrong.
I wasnt driving my wife was, she was describing it to me.

Most likely definitely just the lower intake then, and possible heater core.

[KeWLKaT]

LOL then there you go...

[DJ Hellfire]

LOL then there you go...

Tell me about it. Do a google search on "gm v6 leaking lower intake" and you'll see that it's like a wide spread epidemic among GM V6's. Probably one of the worse cars you could own other than a Daewoo.

[KeWLKaT]

thank god my mother has the 4 cyl version of that car, hahaha. that little ecotec is good but the valvetrain noise is becoming horrible

[DJ Hellfire]

thank god my mother has the 4 cyl version of that car, hahaha. that little ecotec is good but the valvetrain noise is becoming horrible

You should give your mother a kiss for not buying the V6. Don't get me wrong, the V6 has a nice amount of power and pickup, but it's just such a POS!

[nadcicle]

Please tell me you guys are just talking about the 3.4 liter's and not all the V6's GM put out period. The 3.8's and 3800 series, and the 4.3 liters i thought were some of the best V6's put out in their time by GM or any other company for that matter.

I highly agree about the 3.4 liter engines if that is indeed all you guys are talking about and not just "GM" in general with their whole V6 engines.

[mtlelantra]

As for the curdled looking coolant, it's most likely just rust build up due to the coolant never being changed.

If it's dexcool, which I'm sure it is cuz it's GM, then it's probably polymerized coolant. Proper mixing of dexcool absolutely required 100% distilled water. Tap water with residual minerals and chlorine results in polymerization of the glycol with the organic acid corrosion inhibitors.
You also had to do a coolant flush at twice the recommended interval...

[Codenomics]

yup, intake leak

[WytchDctr]

I know they have a bad rap, but I know of atleast one odball uber reliable 3100. Best friend had a 94 and took it to 225,000 miles without any real engine work and to my knowledge no gaskets where replaced. The brakes (rear) had issues and it had a few electrical problems towards the end. He beat the **** out of that car and it keep on going. Car won its first trophy when it had about 215k miles on it. Bracket racing of course. Maybe they want to be driven hard 90% of the time.

The car was spotted in Houston about 6 months ago. Very noticeable exhaust setup. So its still going...

[Codenomics]

the car has some pretty decent balls, when it isnt acting like a POS

[2001VE]

Dexcool can wreck motors if you have a head gasket leak, I have heard. Fudges up inside doing major damage. Most people switch over to the regular green ethylene/propylene stuff. Internet says that GM made a design change in 2002/2003 fixing problem, there are upgraded parts now being used. Ford had their issues with the 3.8 liter engines, they dealt with it better via a silent recall of some sort. Chysler 3.0 Mitubishi's were no hell either.

[DJ Hellfire]

Please tell me you guys are just talking about the 3.4 liter's and not all the V6's GM put out period. The 3.8's and 3800 series, and the 4.3 liters i thought were some of the best V6's put out in their time by GM or any other company for that matter.

I highly agree about the 3.4 liter engines if that is indeed all you guys are talking about and not just "GM" in general with their whole V6 engines.


Well any of their older push-rod V6's. They are all the same design just with different displacements. They all have the horrible intake design, mainly the 3.1's through 3.8's.

Dexcool can wreck motors if you have a head gasket leak, I have heard. Fudges up inside doing major damage.

And it smells REALLY bad too at that point, almost like burnt coffee (if there is such a thing). However, if you flush it at the intervals you are supposed to, you usually won't have that problem. The problem is is that people are waiting until they have a problem or a coolant leak to replace the coolant.

Code, please do not add any stop leak. It will just f things up even more.

[Codenomics]

oh god im not adding stop leak to a gasket leak.
i dont look that ignorant do i? wait...... dont answer that one!

[DJ Hellfire]

oh god im not adding stop leak to a gasket leak.
i dont look that ignorant do i? wait...... dont answer that one!

Sorry! But IMO, that **** should be against world law or something. It clogs heater cores, radiators, and the filter on our flush machine. It just sucks and is less than half assed! I hate it!

[WytchDctr]

^- I agree. That stuff is the devil. :angryfire

[Codenomics]

i have heard horror stories about that crap