NGM Enforcer Install Pics Now Up!!!

[nextgen03gt]

Hello,

For those of you that are folowing the release of our kit, I just posted up some pics of the Enforcer being installed in our 2005 Elantra shop car. There is plenty of room and the install is a piece of cake. Check it out

http://www.hyundaihouseofpower.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3063

Thanks T.C.

[yamaha]

Looks good! Will you also be supporting the older BetaI crowd as well?

[NY2002ElantraGT]

from what i read in the original thread, he plans on having this kit work for both beta 1 and beta 2 motors.

[Pete03GLS]

i creamed my pants... now i have to go take a shower. thanx

[Deviant]

Looking good, keep it up!

[slyderdai]

How Much?????? I have been waiting for this forever.

[Keyan]

holy jesus.

[CornbreadXD]

wow, that looks like an easy install ,start saving

[rusto85]

Freaking sweet!:drool: It looks like it'll be a good product. Keep it going. :thumbsup:

[KeWLKaT]

Sweet!

[NY2002ElantraGT]

who wants to buy my turbo?

[KeWLKaT]

Hahahahahaha.

Sorry.

I won't be buying this kit though. Ever.

Saving money so I can buy a nice car when I graduate :) And prolly keep the XD as a beater forever yay. Plus I will be studying overseas for a year in not too long so that would be uncool since I won't even drive my car lol.

[Keyan]

who wants to buy my turbo?

I'll buy your turbo but i don't know what you're going to do with the rest of the kit LOL

[SilverElantra]

been waiting for this for a long time, cant wait to see final numbers and pricing.

[Blackcasper2005]

Yeah Ive been waiting too, I just need to know the price

[TURBOgls]

holly ****! i was just about to post in the thread to ask for progress! YES

[Matrixloader]

HOLY CRAP! its real! its really REAL!!
when can i buy this?

[04GTboySC]

im totally in for this depending on price

[Cypher]

Even I am interested to see what the price ends up being. Also, it appears with the hood modification that those of you considering CF hoods may be SOL.

[NY2002ElantraGT]

i saw that, and i got nervous. wonder how that will work out

[Cypher]

It may not work.

[CornbreadXD]

i don't know about that, he just cut the heatshield. w/ the carbon fiber hood you could use a few hoodspacers and use the dynamat heatshield stuff on that area or even insulation tape used for duct work which is a little less thick but will still dissipate heat, and also have the underside of the hood coated with thermal paint to keep the heat from getting to it if needed.
http://www.b-quiet.com/big/corrado.jpg
http://www.b-quiet.com/hliner.html

[Cypher]

I guess we will see in due time.

[nextgen03gt]

Hello,

To answer your question about the cutout for the IAC, it will not affect anything paint wise what so ever. With the mat the way it was uncut, the IAC barely touched the mat. I cut it to make clearance realizing that there is another 3/4" of hollow area behind the mat. I know you guys have turbo, turbo, turbo on your minds thinking that a blower gives off the same amount of heat as a turbo under the hood and your way off the mark. You will be able to make multiple passes at the track and miles and miles of driving pull over and put your hand directly on the blower. We are not using hot exhaust to drive the blower, totally different animal. I am extremely happy with the way it all fits. There is a huge amount of room behind the blower to fire wall and I can mount the blower and everything to the manifold all assembled and install it onto the head in one step. I will have more pictures up later today of the entire 6 groove belt system run and everything just fell in place. The belt routing, and idler assemblies fell right where they need to be and clear ALL of the hard and soft lines for the AC, powersteering, ect. I know that a lot of you have skeptisizm about having a supercharger on a I4, but with the right blower and components, trust me the power curve, reliability, and maintenance is second to none. No, we are not building BIG horsepower cars here, we are building strong, reliable daily commutes that will put down a power curve that will make it feel just as strong as a turbo car with 100 more whp. Thats why I designed this kit. With the MP62, we shouldnt have to turn it hard to make good reliable power that is extremely easy to tune because of the power curve being so predictable. It makes instant and consistant boost, right off idle. This means awesome lowend torque, resulting in better ET's and 60ft times. Boost control, is changed with a pulley. Only one variable in the system. So, stay tuned as I unwrap the whole package. Also, I am welding up a MAP sensor flange on the intake so this kit will be MAP and MAF friendly and I will be finishing up the external IAC control for the BetaI guys.

Thanks T.C.

[only1db]

i want to see numbers on this...

[SilverElantra]

i planned on doing a scoop either way, whether i have cf hood or not, so remember everyone there are options, also modifying a cf hood will be fairly simple and since its not even in production yet for you guys ask carbonman if he could use different ways of bracing the hood to allow for a s/c upgrade.

[Matrixloader]

the EVOX hood carbonman is making has a scoop on it, so it should give the needed clearance for the S/C.

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t111/Matrixloader/ny2002gtcarbonXDcopy-1.jpg
http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t111/Matrixloader/evoXDhood1.jpg

[Silentwolf]

Another thing. The ONLY strut bar i'm willing to bet on fitting with the SC is the Tib DC Sports bar. Pulley looks to be in the way for the OEM bar and most others try to go over the top of the IM which is now higher with the SC.

[Keyan]

RRM makes a s/c friendly bar.

[Silentwolf]

And it bolts to one strut point and i dont think it would clear, but it is more questionable.

[04GTboySC]

well if i get the s/c i will see if my rrm strut bar fits i guess lol

[NY2002ElantraGT]

The RRM Stut bar may only bolt to one bolt, but it is probably one of the best strut bars out there. you can move your entire car by shaking that bar and after Rickna got into a head on collision and the fire wall and stut mounts were pushed back, the bar bent in the middle. when they took the bar off it popped right back straight as an arrow!

im willing to bet the RRM bar will be the only one to fit as well

[agdaniels]

did anybody else lol at the ugly stock intake system on the shiny new s/c?

I dont really care to much about the numbers it puts down, 160 - 190 to the wheels is a helluva lot better then the 110 my auto has now *for much cheaper then n/a

[seanski]

im going to start saving right now! lol thats sick. awaiting price...:rolleyes:

[Pete03GLS]

saving? pfft, just open up a new credit card n CHARGE IT SON!!!! thats what im probably gonna end up doing... :/ lmfao i got like 2,500 grand to pay off right now, so hopefully by the time this is actually out. ill b done paying this **** off n manage to save some money up for it.

[04GTboySC]

^ agrees with pete lol im just gona get a credit card for this and then close it once its paid for

they just posted more pictures and it does appear with my RRM bar there wont be a clearance problem with it whoo hoo

[Matrixloader]

This is just making me too exited but im also wondering, for us california guys having the most strick smog inspections, since we are not touching any of the cats, keeping stock header and stock intake if we prefer like in the pic do you guys think there is a 50/50 chance this might be sreet legal depending on numbers? last time i did a smog check, the smog guys said the law is different now, as long as your car passes smog it dont matter what mods you got... as long as you pass.

I really want this S/C bad. it almost looks stock too.
http://www.ngmhouseofpower.com/ngmimages/mini-DSC02431.JPG

[CornbreadXD]

gawd damn there is A LOT of room in there. and it shouldn't have any effect on the smog laws, i remember some dodge people talking about that on another forum i use to go to when I had my daytona.

[Matrixloader]

oh man if this is street legal, then i think i need to go buy some diapers before i wet my pants.

[checkengine]

does it goes ok with an auto tranny? of course ill add a aux cooler !!!

[Pete03GLS]

yea it works with an auto, most of the super charged elantras ive seen, are automatic, as a matter of fact, on some of the videos that were posted on here, all auto elantras.

[cclngthr]

yea it works with an auto, most of the super charged elantras ive seen, are automatic, as a matter of fact, on some of the videos that were posted on here, all auto elantras.

ECU tuning will be the issue though. With the auto, you have to retain the stock ECU for the trans control and a piggyback added to that to alter fuel and maf sensor readings.

[SilverElantra]

umm not necessarily^^^also i would like more information from you matrix on the smog thing cause i have my smog certs and never heard of that.

[Silentwolf]

I really want this S/C bad. it almost looks stock too.
http://www.ngmhouseofpower.com/ngmimages/mini-DSC02431.JPG


With the way that pics looks both the DC sports and RRM bar would work.
But i'm still no fan of one bolt design stress is pinpointed onto one bolt rather spread out of two or three.

As for price, its gonna be hard to shell out 4k+ for the kit. I rather think a custom turbo kit could be built for cheaper.

[Matrixloader]

umm not necessarily^^^also i would like more information from you matrix on the smog thing cause i have my smog certs and never heard of that.


thats the thing where i was confused, the last time i did a smog i had my accord intake on and the smog place i took it too that was next door to a dmv said that now a days as long as your car passes smog then it dont matter if you have mods in it, as long as it passes. I still need to talk to someone else to verify this (maybe a if i can talk to a reff), my car passed with zero emissions with just the Accord CAI, but im just concerned about how it would test with a Supercharger.

[Pete03GLS]

im pretty sure, from that pic atleast, the ark bar will fit too, since it goes up a lil then over.

[Silentwolf]

im pretty sure, from that pic atleast, the ark bar will fit too, since it goes up a lil then over.

No, that IAC unit will be in the way, hence the cutting of the hood mat just to give a lil extra room above the unit.

[Pete03GLS]

wat is iac?

[Matrixloader]

idle air control valve, its that thing on top of the throttle body.

[Pete03GLS]

yea, the ark bar is no where near that, the ark bar, sits an inch or less away from the fire wall, theres plenty of room for that thing to clear it, even when the engine moves, or atleast i think. ill test fit my bar when i get my charger n let u guy know. and if theres fitment issues, ill produce a custom bar that will use the brackets i got with my ark bar, and it will clear all SC parts.

[Matrixloader]

here is a side view
http://www.ngmhouseofpower.com/ngmimages/mini-DSC02430.JPG

[KeWLKaT]

gotta love the stock intake

[Pete03GLS]

oh ****, my bad, i was looking at the wrong thing. sorry, yea... seems tight, ESPECIALLY if the engine moves, but someone said ull need solid mounts, so there may not be much if any movement, which might make it safe enuff to use the bar. ill grind out some of my bar if i have to, to make it fit.

[cclngthr]

umm not necessarily^^^also i would like more information from you matrix on the smog thing cause i have my smog certs and never heard of that.

When you have the auto transmission, the ecu does integrate the TCM with the ECM function and a stand alone PCM would not work. Reflashing the ECM would also have to be configured for the TCM functions as well, which only complicates things even more, which I've heard that you can create problems on the TCM functionality if you try to alter the ECM side too much.

[evan938]

As for price, its gonna be hard to shell out 4k+ for the kit. I rather think a custom turbo kit could be built for cheaper.

not a quality kit. ive said it before, ill say it again. cheap, powerful, reliable. you can only pick 2. i had close to 4k into my kit way back in the day, parting it together bit by bit, and still had a few more parts to get (something for ecu tuning, clutch kit, dyno time, misc problems that always come up during installs, etc)

[Pete03GLS]

****... but its do able right, even on an automatic...? because the super charged elantras ive seen from some of the korean videos... were all automatics.

[SilverElantra]

it should not pose a problem supercharger the car, if you start to mess with fuel and all that it could very well cause a problem, but if ngm sells thier engine management as part of thier kit it could eliminate any problems.

[Pete03GLS]

well, at some point i planned on throwing on some 290cc injectors. hmm, i guess we'll have to wait n see, or i need to find a 5spd xd.

[Matrixloader]

I was just looking at the ngm v6 iced sniper supercharger, its design is similar in some ways using the same mp62 supercharger. the v6 kit gives 200hp at just 2-4lbs boost

im guessing the I4 would net somewhere around 170hp but turning the boost up and with other mods in place would net more than 200hp. we will just have to wait a little longer and see what the numbers show.
if the v6 kit goes for less than 4k the I4 would probably be around the same price.

check it out. http://ngmhouseofpower.com/product_info.php?cPath=22&products_id=157

[yamaha]

A credible tuning source is going to be the biggest issue for this kit. Sure he may be able to do the 16-bit ECU's, but what about the older BetaI crowd that use the 8-bit ECU?

[KeWLKaT]

There's always that megasquirt thingie

LOL

[Deviant]

There's always that megasquirt thingie

LOL

That's what she said.

[Silentwolf]

not a quality kit. ive said it before, ill say it again. cheap, powerful, reliable. you can only pick 2. i had close to 4k into my kit way back in the day, parting it together bit by bit, and still had a few more parts to get (something for ecu tuning, clutch kit, dyno time, misc problems that always come up during installs, etc)

Duh. You think i dont know that, yeesh. I don't need a powerful setup, just reliable.


Thanks for the comparison Matrix. I forgot this was the SC used in the sniper kits and not the assasin setups. So start point could be $3,500. I guess as others say now, lets wait for the numbers.

[jalmir]

Yeah pretty sure it'll be around 3500$, here HPP are targeting 4K including the install.

[ElantraEvo]

maybe in the far future ill put one of these on my xd... twin charged!!!!!

[NY2002ElantraGT]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
start with the turbo and worry about twin charged later! haha

not like i should talk

[SilverElantra]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
start with the turbo and worry about twin charged later! haha

not like i should talk

nope, you have no room to talk.

[KeWLKaT]

BWahahahahahhaha

(see sig)

[SilverElantra]

lol that exactly what i was thinking about, i was hoping you would see that post.

[2003GT]

WOW I would defiantly do this. That would be sweet to blow off some guy in a civic or something eqiv. I wonder if it installs as easy as the guy says it does. BOB

[agdaniels]

this thread was dead for a reason.

and you already can beat civics. look at their specs compared to the elantras.

[SilverElantra]

this thread was dead for a reason.

and you already can beat civics. look at their specs compared to the elantras.

and what reason is the thread dead for?

[2003GT]

The product isn't even out yet. We are all still interested in this product but no one has posted in a month. BOB

[Tricked]

So it's dead???!!
http://www.ngmhouseofpower.com/ngmimages/mini-scan0001.jpg

[agdaniels]

WOW I would defiantly do this. That would be sweet to blow off some guy in a civic or something eqiv. I wonder if it installs as easy as the guy says it does. BOB

This has already been discussed multiple times in this thread. No need to revive the thread to discuss it again. Hence why it's dead.

So it's dead???!!
http://www.ngmhouseofpower.com/ngmimages/mini-scan0001.jpg


If you want to talk about the dyno results (which is month old news to begin with) start a new thread, this one was about engine pics of the s/c.

[jalmir]

lolll it's not dead, they ARE working on it, things like that doesn't appear out of thin air, they have being working on this for a long time and I prefer them still working on it then getting it out as an half finished kit!!!

I'm wondering when they will appear at our Canadian dealers! :D

[j0hnh0lmes]

This has already been discussed multiple times in this thread. No need to revive the thread to discuss it again. Hence why it's dead.

If you want to talk about the dyno results (which is month old news to begin with) start a new thread, this one was about engine pics of the s/c.


Dude STFU!! A newbie can comment on a thread. Hey look...I just did too.

[jalmir]

Dude STFU!! A newbie can comment on a thread. Hey look...I just did too.

hahahahaha

I have to say he have a "****ty-mod" attitude and only have 160 post! :rolleyes:

[SilverElantra]

This thread is far from dead, but yes we are waiting for further results. but hey instead of calling it dead lets just insist they bring the product out now, unfinished. thats a great idea, we should just demand it. dumb****.

[Cypher]

I'm sure that TC has updated it on his forum.

[agdaniels]

All of you need to relax. This thread was about engine pics. Not whether or not he's still working on it, or whether or not he should take his time with r&d. Engine pics. What he brought up after the thread was dead 2 months had ALREADY been discussed multiple times.

And i'm acting like a mod because I use common sense? Thats not saying much for the general population then.

/thread.

[jalmir]

No you're acting like a mod 'cause you're telling people what to do or not, even if the thread is 2 months old we can all post in it as long as it's related to the primary subject, which is the NGM 4cyl SC ...

Even if this was to show the install the thread can be about the general info/discussion about it, I don't see why YOU should decide if we all can post in a thread or not, unless I'm mistaken you're not a mod/admin.

EDIT : BTW, I didn't see any comment from Cypher about not talking about NGM supercharger in a NGM supercharger thread ...

/agdaniels comments

[Cypher]

As long as it pertains to the supercharger, than its revelant.

[SilverElantra]

I'm sure that TC has updated it on his forum.

ugh how dare you not ask agdaniels first. asshole^^^^ sheesh. what kind of a mod are you not asking a regular joe blow if its ok.

[j0hnh0lmes]

Can someone point me to the thread with the dyno? Was it stock except for the S/C when they dyno'd?

[jalmir]

too lazy to search for the thread but yeah, appart the SC and a few parts the engine was all stock (including the exhaust!)

[SilverElantra]

everything was stock and it was untuned at the time.

[2003GT]

If we were to star a new post Felix would block it and Yell at us for there already being one relating to the supercharger. You just don't care about it as much as the rest do. You posted after me so Technically your posting in a dead thread too. DipShat. BOB

[Cypher]

If we were to star a new post Felix would block it and Yell at us for there already being one relating to the supercharger. You just don't care about it as much as the rest do. You posted after me so Technically your posting in a dead thread too. DipShat. BOB

I deleted alot of posts but I wanted to address this. Your one post was locked because you posted about a very common thing that didn't really need a thread. I left your other one open to be nice. I usually lock threads when you start ANOTHER thread related to the one that was locked once before.

Now kiddies, everyone calm down and absolutely no personal insults.

[2003GT]

Thanks Cypher for being so nice. See by not blocking it I have mad a few advancements in getting a clear marker made. Also Thanks for deleting all of that banter. Sorry bout that But I will not back down. Its gonna get me Killed some day. :D BOB

[Tricked]

If you want to talk about the dyno results (which is month old news to begin with) start a new thread, this one was about engine pics of the s/c.
Yes, sir!:jerkit:
Here's the thread (http://www.hyundaihouseofpower.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3063&page=5) where I found it........where it was posted almost 2 months ago!!:eek::rolleyes:

[2003GT]

Hey what do you think this will do to my MPG. Do you think it will drastically drop it. I am very interested in this. I am curious to see what it might cost though. Maybe a grand or less probably not though. BOB

[jalmir]

I deleted alot of posts but I wanted to address this. Your one post was locked because you posted about a very common thing that didn't really need a thread. I left your other one open to be nice. I usually lock threads when you start ANOTHER thread related to the one that was locked once before.

Now kiddies, everyone calm down and absolutely no personal insults.

thanks man ... but you should've keep the post where he said I was cool, that was all true and the only recent post that was actually important ...

so here it is :

Yeah, I know I'm cool :cool: :D


BTW Tricked thx for the link, I thought there was a thread here about the dyno results ... but anyway! :D

[2003GT]

I personally like tricked's response to this. :jerkit:

[SilverElantra]

Hey what do you think this will do to my MPG. Do you think it will drastically drop it. I am very interested in this. I am curious to see what it might cost though. Maybe a grand or less probably not though. BOB

with it tuned the right way ur mpg should not suffer drastically, but it can make a difference.

[2003GT]

Any Developments yet.

[Tricked]

T.C. is on vacation. Read through the thread that I posted a link to and it explains quite a bit.

[03GT]

Hey what do you think this will do to my MPG. Do you think it will drastically drop it. I am very interested in this. I am curious to see what it might cost though. Maybe a grand or less probably not though. BOB

Hard to say for sure, but the SC V6 mazda I had typically got 29mpg hwy and about 24mpg city. Compared to my NA GT getting 34hwy and 28city. Granted they're two very different engines/cars etc.. but I cant imagine the mpg of a SC XD being worse than the SC mazda I had. Of course we won't know until somebody is brave enough to buy that SC and put it to the test.

(waiting eagerly)

[2003GT]

Once my parents don't own the car anymore. I have a damn good job and maybe another car or just no ware to go. :) I would like to get this kit. I would have to beef up the tranny though because its a Auto.

[CornbreadXD]

"beefing your tranny" (that sounds funny) would only require a cooler which you could install now

[SilverElantra]

you can get the tranny chryogenetically treated, but thats expensive. who knows what will be needed once the car is tuned. the numbers could be great and then again could not be.

[03GT]

Once my parents don't own the car anymore. I have a damn good job and maybe another car or just no ware to go. :) I would like to get this kit. I would have to beef up the tranny though because its a Auto.

I'm with ya, I'd really like to get my hands on this kit. At this point all the mods I'm making are keeping the SC in mind. Luckily I have the 5 speed but I'll still need to upgrade the clutch. But I'm trying to hold off until I need to do it. So other upgrades are in the works before the clutch. I know it's premature to ask for a price, but dang I'd really like a ballpark. The three hour install time gives me a chubby.

[only1db]

"beefing your tranny" (that sounds funny) would only require a cooler which you could install now

the auto already have a cooler, you could put an aftermarket cooler...and obviously you wont put one on a manual.

[2003GT]

I wouldn't need anything else. I am afraid I would destroy it with all the power going to it. I wouldn't need to replace pressure plates or springs to make it shift harder.

[agdaniels]

search around for autos with turbo setups. i've heard the auto is good up to 200hp with a trans cooler, and i've also heard its good for a lot more.


There are some supercharged automatic tiburons putting down huge numbers

[mayollo072R]

search around for autos with turbo setups. i've heard the auto is good up to 200hp with a trans cooler, and i've also heard its good for a lot more.


There are some supercharged automatic tiburons putting down huge numbers


Actually most of the fastest hyundais are auto, i.e. apemotorsports 10.7s tiburon, la pulga 9.2s accent, etc. The thing is that this OEM trannys are modified to handle the power and who knows which torque converter they're using.

[yamaha]

Actually most of the fastest hyundais are auto, i.e. apemotorsports 10.7s tiburon, la pulga 9.2s accent, etc. The thing is that this OEM trannys are modified to handle the power and who knows which torque converter they're using.

La Pulga Accent was a 5-speed. The automatic transmission can handle power as long as it's not abused. The torque converter is the weak link. Most of the times the fins will get bent and then the converter just takes a dump.

[SilverElantra]

the auto tranny can easily hold 250 but you can push 300 without abuse and a good cooler.

[yamaha]

the auto tranny can easily hold 250 but you can push 300 without abuse and a good cooler.

You can assume, but until you have seen someone do it or have done it yourself it's all speculation.

[Pete03GLS]

seems like it can barely hold 120hp... im about to be on my 3rd!!!! lol

[Cypher]

dvandek (sp?) from NT has been running his turbo tib with a t3 super 60 at 20 psi with a dual cooler setup for over a year. His last update said that his car was still doing fine.

[SilverElantra]

and there you have it.

[faraco3]

Tuff call, get this kit or continue waiting for the Genesis Coupe. Damn

I will have to see really if it will be CARB approved for the wonderful state of CA.

[03GT]

I don't see why not.. they are all kinds of supercharged from the factory cars in CA. You're not changing any of the smog equipment, you're just forcing more air and fuel in to the engine. But it is the communist state of CA where you have to get a permit to trim your trees.

[Codenomics]

CAI intakesah, the joys of living in cali...... cant wait to move, become rich and buy one of these SCs



::shudder::

[SilverElantra]

more than likely you will never see a smog legal anything for our cars for CA. The cost that companies have to pay to have them CARB legal is not worth it for a small company like them. but, i have heard rumor that in cali starting this year you can have any part on the car and its legal as long as ur car passes smog without a CEL. for now its hear say, but im keeping my eyes and ears open on this new "rumor".

[optimoprime]

heres a good solution if you have an AUTO then you probably shouldnt be doing too much to your car anyways. automatic = no performance gains (ive been in fast auto's but why even bother?)

[agdaniels]

heres a good solution if you have an AUTO then you probably shouldnt be doing too much to your car anyways. automatic = no performance gains (ive been in fast auto's but why even bother?)

I hope you realize how ignorant you just made yourself sound.

[Cypher]

^For once, I think I agree with you.

[SilverElantra]

ya that was extremely ignorant on ur side optimo, which i kind of disappointing. theres some people on this forum you just dont expect to say stupid **** like that and ur one of them.

[yamaha]

heres a good solution if you have an AUTO then you probably shouldnt be doing too much to your car anyways. automatic = no performance gains (ive been in fast auto's but why even bother?)

Automoatic's in OEM form cannot be beat on, look at the APE Tiburon, with some valvework and higher stall, it run's faster then what most forced induction Hyundai's do.

[mayollo072R]

La Pulga Accent was a 5-speed. The automatic transmission can handle power as long as it's not abused. The torque converter is the weak link. Most of the times the fins will get bent and then the converter just takes a dump.

Was` five speed when it was 9.8s. For the 9.2s record he used an auto tranny with a modified valve body, clutches and unknown (for me) converter

There was a report on Super Compacto magazine about it were he described what he did to it.

In this video at the end he said that is the fastest automatic FWD car of PR and the world plus you can tell from the launch

http://youtube.com/watch?v=69kvPiozb0I

[2003GT]

Most of the Time like stated you cant shift that fast. Why does Summit racing sell Autos good to like 600hp out of the box then if they are a waste.

[yamaha]

Nevermind, you are correct, know we just need to find what garage they put the car in after he passed away.

[CornbreadXD]

yeah there are plenty of fast cars that are auto, i think it'd be fine to supercharge the car, optimo, you've seen those automatic supercharged tibs at the emco gears classic so you can't equate auto to no performance.

[BobMs_wht2k2]

Most of the Time like stated you cant shift that fast. Why does Summit racing sell Autos good to like 600hp out of the box then if they are a waste.

Huh? The trans they sell there are for drag cars. A drag only car will be more consisitent with an auto and with the amount and type of power just as quick, if not quicker.

But we're not talking about a 600hp, RWD drag car are we? We're taling about a (stock) 140hp econobox. BIG difference. Might as well compare an apple to a shoe.

[mayollo072R]

Nevermind, you are correct, know we just need to find what garage they put the car in after he passed away.

His daughter has it since he passed away. They wont sell it or tear it apart. It apparently has a great sentimental value for them.
Unfortunately in the article he just describes that he modified the tranny clutches, valve body and torque converter but when he was asked for how he said to the interviewer that it was a secret.:(

[SilverElantra]

well either way saying an auto is junk is just shooting **** out of ur mouth. auto's will always shift faster than anyone can shift a manual. it may take a lil more power to have them keeping up with the manuals, but overall the auto's can handle forced induction.

[BobMs_wht2k2]

well either way saying an auto is junk is just shooting **** out of ur mouth. auto's will always shift faster than anyone can shift a manual. it may take a lil more power to have them keeping up with the manuals, but overall the auto's can handle forced induction.

Now you're shooting **** out of your mouth. Many autos shift slower than most manuals. But they are more CONSISITENT. In bracket racing consistency is the key.

[yamaha]

Consistency in forced induction applications as well. The motor will continue to spool the turbo and you will have boost during a run.

[Pete03GLS]

yea, auto deff shifts slower. uve never seen videos of people speed shifting? hell, even i used to do it, in my excel, and even in my dads sx4. a good driver can shift a manual faster than any automatic ever could.

[KeWLKaT]

Ok, everyone. Keep this about the ACTUAL SUPERCHARGER.

If I get ONE more post about automatic transmissions, this thread is getting cleaned up, BIG time.

[Silentwolf]

Well, here's some math to consider. Since TC is testing on an Auto, and measuring the WHP, then would not a manual have more power at the wheels? What the cascade difference?

[Tricked]

Ok, everyone. Keep this about the ACTUAL SUPERCHARGER.

If I get ONE more post about automatic transmissions, this thread is getting cleaned up, BIG time.

:clap::clap::clap::clap:

[nextgen03gt]

Hello,

Hey guys, check out the new update on the Enforcer project. I think you will all likey!!!!

http://www.hyundaihouseofpower.com/forum/showthread.php?p=59361#post59361

Thanks T.C.

[mayollo072R]

Speechless!:bowdown:

[agdaniels]

Hello,

Im am super excited about this update. I have come back from being out of town to clear my head for a little while and jumped on the Enforcer Elantra project and have made major headway. For starters, we have the new equal length header installed. I have completed the custom 3" cold air system for the Elantra that will be available for sale for the Elantra guys. This will handle getting the volume to the MP62. Next, I have done a throttle body conversion by mounting our new Tri-Flo 70mm throttle body and 70mm billet plenum to the blower to handle getting the volume the blower needs. Monday, I am installing the custom mandrel bent 2.5" exhaust system that will mate to the equal length header and extend out the back to a nice highflow polished stainless muffler. This exhaust system will also be available for the Elantra guys for purchase as a stocking part in the NGM Toy Store. I am also installing a set of NGM plug-n-play exclusive 460cc injectors to take care of the fueling.

The best part of this whole deal is that I am able to tune the whole package via our NGM reflashing system. So, yes, the Enforcer kits will come with reflashes tuned to each particular stage of kit with the accomodating mods.

So, I am very excited as I get closer to releashing this kit as it will be a complete package at every stage.

http://www.ngmhouseofpower.com/ngmimages/mini-DSC02746.JPG

http://www.ngmhouseofpower.com/ngmimages/mini-DSC02747.JPG


freaking amazing. a complete kit, including mandrel bent exhaust that he could probably customize to sit behind the bumper

beyond excited.

[slyderdai]

How much???????? I've been wanting (secretly saving for) this for forever!!!!!!
completely bolt on and go! I'm all about that son! Do work!
What about the strut tower bar?? Are you gonna make one that works or are there any clearance issues?? Inquiring minds want to know?

[cbogg]

Closer, oh so closer. I can't wait for the next dyno run, I may have to sell a child so I can get this! I'm sure I can teach them to make shoes or something.... lol

[sciphi]

Wow. Seeing this kit makes me want to buy an XD just to have the supercharger! And emissions-legal if keeping the stock exhaust manifold. Not to mention lack of maintenance, and the possibility of decent fuel economy if you keep your right foot off of the floor.

[Blackcasper2005]

Update with dyno numbers

http://www.hyundaihouseofpower.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3978

[cbogg]

That's some decent power with some bolt ons, little boost and mild tune. If he gets this thing tuned right, running 10psi or more, this thing could be crazy! and a lot easier to work with than the turbo setups.

[yamaha]

Good numbers, you still won't be able to make thew power you can with a turbocharger.

[cbogg]

Good numbers, you still won't be able to make thew power you can with a turbocharger.

Definitely not, but I think with the ease of installation, and the fact that I think this I probably gonna be a lot more reliable and easier to work on, a lot of us will sacrifice some power for that. Not everyone needs 300hp on 19 psi of boost, some of us would just like to not have to close our eyes and pray when pulling out to pass someone or merge on the highway.

[Matrixloader]

Even if i make 180hp i would be so happy with it, less HP than turbo but it will be a decent fast elantra and very realiable for daily driving. at 180hp you got an elantra thats already faster than a civic SI , v6 tib or scion TC, and whe are talking wheel HP here not at the crank, but knowing how much work TC is putting in to this it will most likely make close to 190hp - 200hp on a 5spd stage 1 setup.

I cant wait till this is out.

[themarin8r]

the power would be available sooner than with a turbo since the supercharger is belt driven
that and it would be a flatter curve

[Matrixloader]

I just hope i can have this installed in my car and still be street legal in california.

If not its gona suck having to remove the whole kit and reinstall again every time i need to do a smog.

guess will have to wait and see.

[Silentwolf]

Keep the OEM header setup and i'd think u could pass. But dont quote me

[dmdicks]

I just hope i can have this installed in my car and still be street legal in california.

If not its gona suck having to remove the whole kit and reinstall again every time i need to do a smog.

guess will have to wait and see.

The ONLY way this kit will be legal for sale in California is if TC invests the time and serious money to get it CARB certified. Judging how he said he was getting his V6 kit CARB certified over 2yrs ago and actually didn't do it, I wouldn't hold my breath.

I'm actually pretty dissappointed in these numbers. For someone who supposedly has the power to reflash the OE ECU these are really low, even for an automatic. I got 170whp with a MP45 Alpine setup on an Auto with stock intake, exhaust and just using a Unichip and 5th injector. Oh and that was on a Mustang dyno as well at 6psi. I expected more.

[SilverElantra]

^^^ same, but lets see with a final tune.

[NY2002ElantraGT]

The ONLY way this kit will be legal for sale in California is if TC invests the time and serious money to get it CARB certified. Judging how he said he was getting his V6 kit CARB certified over 2yrs ago and actually didn't do it, I wouldn't hold my breath.

I'm actually pretty dissappointed in these numbers. For someone who supposedly has the power to reflash the OE ECU these are really low, even for an automatic. I got 170whp with a MP45 Alpine setup on an Auto with stock intake, exhaust and just using a Unichip and 5th injector. Oh and that was on a Mustang dyno as well at 6psi. I expected more.

numbers are low.... but that was with nooooooooo fuel tunning. that was just the stock ecu, stock tune. so numbers should increase by a large number

[dmdicks]

Um...taken directly from his website...

Mods:
Equall length header
2.5" catback exhaust
70mm TB
NGM 3" CAI
NGM 460cc injectors
NGM Reflashing
Enforcer kit 3.4" supercharger pulley

[slyderdai]

Um...taken directly from his website...

Mods:
Equall length header
2.5" catback exhaust
70mm TB
NGM 3" CAI
NGM 460cc injectors
NGM Reflashing
Enforcer kit 3.4" supercharger pulley

Um not exactly......

Mods:
Equall length header
2.5" catback exhaust
70mm TB
NGM 3" CAI
NGM 460cc injectors
NGM Reflashing
Enforcer kit 3.4" supercharger pulley

Stock Dyno Jet Numbers 105whp&105ftlbs
Stock Dyno Jet Numbers With Base Enforcer(5-6lbs)142whp&138ftlbs
Stage I Enforcer(4.4-5.2lbs)(H,Ex,BBTB,CAI,Injectors,Partial Tune) 167whp&170ftlbs
which means............. still not finished with the tune as I need to fine tune the A/F some more and play with the the timing yet. Maybe we will see in the high 170's to 180's from the automatic. As I get the tunes finalized, I will post the entire dyno sheet with whp, tq, A/F and boost readings on each one so that there is no speculation what so ever.



Hater!!!!!!!

[dmdicks]

I'm not a hater, just dissappointed is all. There has been so much hype about this 'kit' with very little information to justify the hype. People are getting their hopes up that they will be able to bolt up this 'kit' and make TC's intial claims of 250WHP. That's just not the case. Power numbers should not be stated unless a final tune is complete and the actual kit contents are verified.
People NEED to understand that it's very difficult to make a lot of supercharged horsepower on the Beta2 engine. It responds MUCH BETTER to turbocharging. In order to get 250WHP Supercharged you WILL NEED the below items that will probably not come with the base kit:

2.5" Header back exhaust system
tuned Headers
Cold Air Intake
70 MM BBTB
Port Matched Intake Manfold (Some Manifolds won't go this big)
190lph Fuel Pump

I HIGHLY doubt the above will be included with the 'kit'. If it was included you can expect to spend upwards of 8,000 USD for all the above plus the kit.

Also my response was to 2k's response of no tune. Partial tune is just that, a partial tune. Why even post numbers of a partial tune anyways?

[agdaniels]

I'm not a hater, just dissappointed is all. There has been so much hype about this 'kit' with very little information to justify the hype. People are getting their hopes up that they will be able to bolt up this 'kit' and make TC's intial claims of 250WHP. That's just not the case. Power numbers should not be stated unless a final tune is complete and the actual kit contents are verified.
People NEED to understand that it's very difficult to make a lot of supercharged horsepower on the Beta2 engine. It responds MUCH BETTER to turbocharging. In order to get 250WHP Supercharged you WILL NEED the below items that will probably not come with the base kit:

2.5" Header back exhaust system
tuned Headers
Cold Air Intake
70 MM BBTB
Port Matched Intake Manfold (Some Manifolds won't go this big)
190lph Fuel Pump

I HIGHLY doubt the above will be included with the 'kit'. If it was included you can expect to spend upwards of 8,000 USD for all the above plus the kit.

Also my response was to 2k's response of no tune. Partial tune is just that, a partial tune. Why even post numbers of a partial tune anyways?

Wow I completely see where youre coming from. He should have just left us in the dark about the progress he's making until he's completely done. And I agree, he shouldn't have started this project in the first place since the goal of 250whp might be unattainable from a SIMPLE bolt on kit. 200whp on our 2700lbs cars is way too disappointing for the 3-4 hours it would take to install this thing.

[chris929]

"Anyhow, all of our tuning and testing will be done on a loaded Mustang Dyno so that we can have accurate tunes, but will be converting to Dyno Jet numbers so that way you guys can have a better idea on numbers since you are all used to seeing Dyno Jet numbers made at different stages. So, yesterday we took the 05 automatic Enforcer Elantra and strapped her to the dyno. I wanted to work with the reflashing software that I have to work on a tune. The mods that are currently on the car, are as you saw in the latest pictures. "

Sounds like the 167whp&170ftlbs was a converted number aswell.. so if thats the case on the mustang dyno it woulda been around 150 whp or less...compared to alpines 170 whp with no breather mods..yikes a bit disapointing indeed.

[dmdicks]

Oh and I'm not supporting Alpine in ANY WAY but the 170whp was non-intercooled.

[Munky]

Not bad, but I still wouldn't pay that much just to get ~40hp gains.

[Keyan]

Not bad, but I still wouldn't pay that much just to get ~40hp gains.

My stock automatic put down 104whp, now tell me that's only 40whp.

[Munky]

My stock automatic put down 104whp, now tell me that's only 40whp.

The average output for our cars at the crank is something like 130-135, that's where I based that off of.

And I still wouldn't pay that much, I would buy a new car.

[03GT]

If the kit were to get up to 8k as dmdicks implied, you'd be better off taking that 8k down to the hyundai dealer and plopping it down an a genesis coupe. That's what I'd do. Really, this kit needs to be priced right. Putting an 8k kit on a 5k car is retarded. Now if the kit were to be in the 3k range that would be doable.

Also look for turbo kits after the genesis comes out since rumor has it the base model will be a turbo I4 making about 200hp. (going off of memory here could be wrong)

[dmdicks]

Genisis base coupe will be powered by the 4B11T engine. This is the same engine in the new Lancer Evolution X just mounted for RWD in the Coupe. This is a brand new all aluminum engine that has zero in common with the Beta2.

[themarin8r]

The average output for our cars at the crank is something like 130-135, that's where I based that off of.

And I still wouldn't pay that much, I would buy a new car.

yeah but this is not rated 170 at the crank, this is to the wheels
so youre comparing two different types of readings

[Munky]

yeah but this is not rated 170 at the crank, this is to the wheels
so youre comparing two different types of readings

Uh, 170 at the wheels would be around 180-185 at the crank. ;)

~180 - ~140 = ~40.

Got it? Cool. Just making sure.

[themarin8r]

Uh, 170 at the wheels would be around 180-185 at the crank. ;)

~180 - ~140 = ~40.

Got it? Cool. Just making sure.

if its rated at 138 at the crank for an auto, and its 105 at the wheels, then it would be a bit more at the crank with the supercharger than 185 because its a much larger % loss to the wheels. Its better to compare the actual dyno numbers, which are 105 to 167 which is a 62hp gain
either way, the numbers should be a little bit better, but again its only running like 6 psi, so a near 60% increase is pretty darn good with breathing mods

and i dont think it would cost near 8k for all the mods including the kit unless the kit itself was like 6k+

[silversharkXD2]

If the kit were to get up to 8k as dmdicks implied, you'd be better off taking that 8k down to the hyundai dealer and plopping it down an a genesis coupe. That's what I'd do. Really, this kit needs to be priced right. Putting an 8k kit on a 5k car is retarded. Now if the kit were to be in the 3k range that would be doable.

Also look for turbo kits after the genesis comes out since rumor has it the base model will be a turbo I4 making about 200hp. (going off of memory here could be wrong)

no offense to DMdicks, but he used to promote for alpine. (No offense DM, but you're kind of biased for that reason. But I understand why. I've given you props in the past, don't forget)

[dmdicks]

No worries man. I know I used to promote Alpine. The key is I do not anymore. I only brought up the numbers because I was the one that tuned the guys kit. My main point is there is a lot of misinformation out there and TC is doing nothing to mitigate it. He's actually helping to spread it.
Bottom line is a 60whp gain is not that impressive considering the mod list and that's its intercooled. I did more with a smaller blower, non-intercooled, with ZERO Mods, other than the MP45 blower kit. Its not a knock, its a challenge! Prove me wrong TC!
Oh and your welcome to bring your auto s/c'd Elantra up to Colorado and run against me at the track. :)

[03GT]

no offense to DMdicks, but he used to promote for alpine. (No offense DM, but you're kind of biased for that reason. But I understand why. I've given you props in the past, don't forget)

That's the b!tch of it all. No competition since Alpine is pretty much MIA. I would think TC would price this product agressively knowing that if the price is too high people won't buy and all that time in R&D was for nothing. Better to make $100 off each unit and sell a bunch then to make $500 of each unit and sell none. Know what I mean?

I looked at the alpine stuff, but after 3 emails with not a single response from them and talking to a couple of Alpines distributors that was enough for me to just say no to Alpine.

Then we got a tease from procharger, and again, I sent a couple emails, never heard a damn thing.

So sadly, if you want a bolt on kit, it looks like TC is going to have the monopoly on it, at least for now.

Genisis base coupe will be powered by the 4B11T engine. This is the same engine in the new Lancer Evolution X just mounted for RWD in the Coupe. This is a brand new all aluminum engine that has zero in common with the Beta2.

Aha, ok I remember reading something about an engine Mitsu/Hyundai were collaborating on a few months back. Seems a bit lame to stick a 200hp I4 in the genesis coupe; they should use the v6 and v8, don't even offer the I4. Put the turbo I4 as the base engine for the Tibby with the v6 as an option. Make the turbo I4 an optional engine for an elantra GT.

[themarin8r]

No worries man. I know I used to promote Alpine. The key is I do not anymore. I only brought up the numbers because I was the one that tuned the guys kit. My main point is there is a lot of misinformation out there and TC is doing nothing to mitigate it. He's actually helping to spread it.
Bottom line is a 60whp gain is not that impressive considering the mod list and that's its intercooled. I did more with a smaller blower, non-intercooled, with ZERO Mods, other than the MP45 blower kit. Its not a knock, its a challenge! Prove me wrong TC!
Oh and your welcome to bring your auto s/c'd Elantra up to Colorado and run against me at the track. :)

its intercooled? ****, well then those numbers suck

[cclngthr]

No worries man. I know I used to promote Alpine. The key is I do not anymore. I only brought up the numbers because I was the one that tuned the guys kit. My main point is there is a lot of misinformation out there and TC is doing nothing to mitigate it. He's actually helping to spread it.
Bottom line is a 60whp gain is not that impressive considering the mod list and that's its intercooled. I did more with a smaller blower, non-intercooled, with ZERO Mods, other than the MP45 blower kit. Its not a knock, its a challenge! Prove me wrong TC!
Oh and your welcome to bring your auto s/c'd Elantra up to Colorado and run against me at the track. :)

its intercooled? ****, well then those numbers suck

I probably could get better results with a stock ECU with no tuning... 60whp is not much, and for the price you pay for the kit, having 60 whp is not worth it IMHO.

That exhaust is a bit big if you ask me. When I ran my project motor on the engine dyno, I got detonation with that and a exhaust leak. Still working on it before I do a full pull on it.

[03GT]

I probably could get better results with a stock ECU with no tuning... 60whp is not much, and for the price you pay for the kit, having 60 whp is not worth it IMHO.

That exhaust is a bit big if you ask me. When I ran my project motor on the engine dyno, I got detonation with that and a exhaust leak. Still working on it before I do a full pull on it.


How can you get detonation from too much exhaust flow/lack of back pressure? That's a fuel mix/timing issue isn't it?

[Silentwolf]

200whp on our 2700lbs cars is way too disappointing for the 3-4 hours it would take to install this thing.

WTF you talking about dude?!? Thats more than a Cobalt SS or Civic Si. Those are only ~200hp at the crank. 200hp to the ground means its ~230hp at the crank. Get an LSD and 200whp on an Elantra and it would be quite fun.



Aha, ok I remember reading something about an engine Mitsu/Hyundai were collaborating on a few months back. Seems a bit lame to stick a 200hp I4 in the genesis coupe; they should use the v6 and v8, don't even offer the I4. Put the turbo I4 as the base engine for the Tibby with the v6 as an option. Make the turbo I4 an optional engine for an elantra GT.

No it doesn't seem lame. We all know what the engine's potential is. And with Gas prices the way it is.

[Pete03GLS]

the turbi i4 will be the best selling out of all the genesis engine options. the end.

[silversharkXD2]

the turbi i4 will be the best selling out of all the genesis engine options. the end.

turbi...what that a typo between a tibby and a turbo...lol

[Pete03GLS]

lmao, i didnt catch that, hehe.

turbo i4. :D

[silversharkXD2]

the turbi i4 will be the best selling out of all the genesis engine options. the end.

the i4 has gotten the most attention from the edmunds/redline article about hyundai letting companies start measuring, but there is a supercharger already in the works for the V6

[Pete03GLS]

oh ofcourse, theres gonna be a list of mods for all models. but the I4 will be the best selling.

[themarin8r]

WTF you talking about dude?!? Thats more than a Cobalt SS or Civic Si. Those are only ~200hp at the crank. 200hp to the ground means its ~230hp at the crank. Get an LSD and 200whp on an Elantra and it would be quite fun.

There have been many dyno's of stock Cobalt SS/SC's getting around 215hp to the wheels, so it would be close to the same performance with the weight difference taken into consideration

[PSUsouthpaw]

***** ***** *****, moan mona moan. Bottom line is that we won't know how much this thing is capable of and how much it will be until its ready to go.

I do hope this kit is priced to be affordable, so it catches on with Elantra owners. However, if it is not priced right, I don't see many selling, and I don't see production continuing on them. Which is truly sad, given how much developmenth as gone into this.

[slyderdai]

Genisis base coupe will be powered by the 4B11T engine. This is the same engine in the new Lancer Evolution X just mounted for RWD in the Coupe. This is a brand new all aluminum engine that has zero in common with the Beta2.

that would be the Mitsubishi version of the world motor. Hyundai block mitsu designed head. The I4 for the genesis coupe has not been released by Hyundai yet so that is pure speculation, and this is not the genesis thread!

I think TC is on the right track with this kit and has been since conception of the idea. You have been a NGM hater for a long time now, I have read your posts here and a few other forums as well. I'm sorry you got burned the most by alpine(not NGM) with what I have seen with the sniper and assassin kits from NGM this is going to be a great performing setup in the end THE END result is what I'm interested in. I like the fact that he post dyno results like this. It's called progressive interest, you keep building up to a dynamic end result.

[Tommy]

***** ***** *****, moan mona moan. Bottom line is that we won't know how much this thing is capable of and how much it will be until its ready to go.

I do hope this kit is priced to be affordable, so it catches on with Elantra owners. However, if it is not priced right, I don't see many selling, and I don't see production continuing on them. Which is truly sad, given how much developmenth as gone into this.



Unfortunately it wont catch on with elantra owners. their biggest customer will be the i4 tib crowd. Just look at how many V6 tib owners have the NGM kit compared to the number of hyundai owners with any sort of f/i.

this kit is promising, for those saying the numbers suck, wtf are you expecting? its not even 100% done and they're seeing a 58% gain in power even with an automatic. Im fairly convinced looking at what its doing with 5lbs of boost, bolt on upgrades and a decent tune that we will see 200hp out of the beta with this setup and a manual transmission. thats a reliable 200hp as well.

And for those concerned about the price, itll be every bit of $3k, and deserving so. If its too rich for your blood, dont complain, because that pricing is right in line with supercharger/turbo kits available to other cars.

[Pete03GLS]

Unfortunately it wont catch on with elantra owners. their biggest customer will be the i4 tib crowd. Just look at how many V6 tib owners have the NGM kit compared to the number of hyundai owners with any sort of f/i.

this kit is promising, for those saying the numbers suck, wtf are you expecting? its not even 100% done and they're seeing a 58% gain in power even with an automatic. Im fairly convinced looking at what its doing with 5lbs of boost, bolt on upgrades and a decent tune that we will see 200hp out of the beta with this setup and a manual transmission. thats a reliable 200hp as well.

And for those concerned about the price, itll be every bit of $3k, and deserving so. If its too rich for your blood, dont complain, because that pricing is right in line with supercharger/turbo kits available to other cars.

Thank You. ^

and i apologize, i didnt realize i was in the ngm thread, when i started talking about the genesis. my bad.

[cbogg]

WTF you talking about dude?!? Thats more than a Cobalt SS or Civic Si. Those are only ~200hp at the crank. 200hp to the ground means its ~230hp at the crank. Get an LSD and 200whp on an Elantra and it would be quite fun.
.

He was being sarcastic.



this kit is promising, for those saying the numbers suck, wtf are you expecting? its not even 100% done and they're seeing a 58% gain in power even with an automatic. Im fairly convinced looking at what its doing with 5lbs of boost, bolt on upgrades and a decent tune that we will see 200hp out of the beta with this setup and a manual transmission. thats a reliable 200hp as well.

And for those concerned about the price, itll be every bit of $3k, and deserving so. If its too rich for your blood, dont complain, because that pricing is right in line with supercharger/turbo kits available to other cars.

I don't often agree with Tommy, but yeah, this thing isn't even done yet, so don't *****. And when you price out making your own turbo kit (or sending it to Canada to have Dennis turbo it), how much are you gonna save by having all the right parts there for you? How many people have turbo'ed their cars, only to end up replacing this and that, and having it cost way more than the initial "kit"? I think this will be good when it's done, and who cares if more guys with tibs buy it than the elantra crowd? It's all about HYUNDAI performance, how many of us have tib parts on our cars? I thought so. So if it ends up promoting the entire brand as more tuner friends, who gives a **** which model they went in? Bring it on TC! I'll be ready.

[cclngthr]

How can you get detonation from too much exhaust flow/lack of back pressure? That's a fuel mix/timing issue isn't it?

No; not necessarily. It happens when the mixture is lean enough and hot enough to preignite. A friend of mine (on a N/A engine) had detonation when he had a big exhaust on his 94 Elantra. He eliminated the detonation by reducing the size of the exhaust tip to 1.75 inches.

Theoretically, detonation happens when the mixture ignites before it is supposed to. On our engines, ignition timing is controlled by the ECU, but when the mixture is at a spot where it is at a certain temperature and more oxygen is mixed into the mixture, it will ignite before the plug fires.

I do hope this kit is priced to be affordable, so it catches on with Elantra owners. However, if it is not priced right, I don't see many selling, and I don't see production continuing on them. Which is truly sad, given how much developmenth as gone into this.

A lot more has to be done, yet before it can be sold. If it is sold as a "kit" it should have provisions for fuel as well as some thought on tuning. I think the exhaust they are using is too large. I also don't think they have thought about the tuning fully yet. The motor, at the flywheel should have at least 220 hp. That translates to a 185 hp at the wheels with the auto. They do have the intercooler, and I think that is a necessary piece to control intake air temps. However, are they changing the maf sensor values? If they are, I think by not changing that and allow the ECU to see the higher reading might net a better hp reading (as I mentioned before, the ECU will ignore the high maf reading as long as the o2 sensor values are within spec). Even with 6 psi, the stock ECU can handle that as long as the fuel ratio is where it should be.

[Silentwolf]

There have been many dyno's of stock Cobalt SS/SC's getting around 215hp to the wheels, so it would be close to the same performance with the weight difference taken into consideration

Stock power numbers for the Cobalt SS SC is 205hp, even on GM's site ( http://www.gmperformanceparts.com/EngineShowcase/index.jsp?engId=Ecotec20LSC&engine=Ecotec%202.OL%20SC&sku=19156264&engCat=rpo )
So how are "stock" Cobalts getting 215? Lightly modded to 215 maybe, smaller pulley, intake and exhaust most likely.

Now what we need to do is wait and see what the final tally is on price and performance of the kits. Most of us already have a cat-back and intake so primary considerations are header and TB that will likely be extras/not in the kit.

[Matrixloader]

lets just wait till its 100% complete before we criticize the Ngm SC.

[themarin8r]

Stock power numbers for the Cobalt SS SC is 205hp, even on GM's site ( http://www.gmperformanceparts.com/EngineShowcase/index.jsp?engId=Ecotec20LSC&engine=Ecotec%202.OL%20SC&sku=19156264&engCat=rpo )
So how are "stock" Cobalts getting 215? Lightly modded to 215 maybe, smaller pulley, intake and exhaust most likely.

Now what we need to do is wait and see what the final tally is on price and performance of the kits. Most of us already have a cat-back and intake so primary considerations are header and TB that will likely be extras/not in the kit.

its called under-rating your motor
trust me on this, there are plenty of dyno charts to prove me right

[Cypher]

^He is correct.

[yamaha]

I believe if he can make 200whp on a decent tune around 7-9psi I believe this will have a following. Even if the kit is in the 3,000-3,500 range, that will still be a reliable kit that can be used on a daily driver. NGM sells nothing but quality work, and the work he has done to the six cylinder is amazing. I won't be a customer as I have enough toy cars, but these will sell.

[03GT]

I believe if he can make 200whp on a decent tune around 7-9psi I believe this will have a following. Even if the kit is in the 3,000-3,500 range, that will still be a reliable kit that can be used on a daily driver. NGM sells nothing but quality work, and the work he has done to the six cylinder is amazing. I won't be a customer as I have enough toy cars, but these will sell.


Exactly, that's what I'm waiting to see. If he can pull it off, these kits will sell. I'd buy one if he does get 200whp and keeps the price around 3k. But any higher $$ than that and I'd really have to think about it with the Genesis coming.

[Silentwolf]

Do you think we could see and extra 30hp with proper tune and +2 psi?



its called under-rating your motor
trust me on this, there are plenty of dyno charts to prove me right

^He is correct.

Under rated or not, thats not going to be a 20-30hp difference. Cause your talking about 10 more hp at the wheels than at the crank. Even if you go light on the tranny loss estimate and only use 10% loss, thats at least 20hp. So if your trying to say GM under rates their engines by over 20hp, I don't think so. Just isn't logical. PM me with the Dynos if you would.

[Cypher]

^Pull your head out of your ***. GM has been under-rating their motors for years. The last gen camaro/firebird was rated at 315hp but was closer to 315whp in all actuality. Now, back onto the focus of the NGM supercharger.

[dmdicks]

A lot of companies under rate their cars. They've been doing is for at least 40 or so years. Take a look at an old 426 Hemi. They were rated at something like 425 HP at the crank. People have been restoring these engines to factory specs and make close to 700 HP!! Look at the new Nissan GTR. Its rated at 480HP but people have been dynoing at over 500 HP to the wheels!

[Silentwolf]

GTR engine is being hand built, and same goes for those old motors.

[dmdicks]

Ok, how about the 2.3L engine in the Mazdaspeed 3? People have been driving off the lot and making almost the rated HP to the wheels?

Most time manufactures don't do it on purpose. It can be related to variables in engine dynos where the engine was certified at. Some do though. Japan is notorius for that. For a LONG time they had a HP rating limit of 280HP. A lot of cars made more than that when it came over to the states. Like the 90's 300zx, Nissan Silvias, and Skylines. Heck even toyota's with the new 3.5L V6 is underated.

Domestic mfrs do it sometimes to avoid the dreaded 'Gas Guzzler' penalty.

[03GT]

Ok, how about the 2.3L engine in the Mazdaspeed 3? People have been driving off the lot and making almost the rated HP to the wheels?

Most time manufactures don't do it on purpose. It can be related to variables in engine dynos where the engine was certified at. Some do though. Japan is notorius for that. For a LONG time they had a HP rating limit of 280HP. A lot of cars made more than that when it came over to the states. Like the 90's 300zx, Nissan Silvias, and Skylines. Heck even toyota's with the new 3.5L V6 is underated.

Domestic mfrs do it sometimes to avoid the dreaded 'Gas Guzzler' penalty.

It's been done since the 60's muscle cars, at that time it was for insurance purposes. examples: http://forums.motortrend.com/70/50205/motor-trend-classic/actual-horsepower-of-60s-70s-hp-engines/index.html

[themarin8r]

I believe if he can make 200whp on a decent tune around 7-9psi I believe this will have a following. Even if the kit is in the 3,000-3,500 range, that will still be a reliable kit that can be used on a daily driver. NGM sells nothing but quality work, and the work he has done to the six cylinder is amazing. I won't be a customer as I have enough toy cars, but these will sell.

Exactly, that's what I'm waiting to see. If he can pull it off, these kits will sell. I'd buy one if he does get 200whp and keeps the price around 3k. But any higher $$ than that and I'd really have to think about it with the Genesis coming.

i totally agree, that would be an excellent goal for this kit and a good price. Most supercharger kits are in the 3k range, and make good power with similar psi


also a link to a thread with dyno sheets of just one guys pull back in 05 when he first got his car
http://www.cobaltss.net/forums/showthread.php?t=2729

[BobMs_wht2k2]

^Pull your head out of your ***. GM has been under-rating their motors for years. The last gen camaro/firebird was rated at 315hp but was closer to 315whp in all actuality. Now, back onto the focus of the NGM supercharger.

I know for a fact that the last Ion Redline was well underrated. A friend of ours that runs the Winged Warrior events dyno'd his STOCK redline at 207hp @ the front wheels.

Personally, that would be a great goal for the NGM to match.

[2003GT]

First those Nissan GTR's are Ugly as SH!T. Also I would like to see what this kit could do. I agree 3-4 hours to bolt on 40+hp has got to be the easiest mod other then Nitrous. Were did it say that the Inter cooler was done. I thought he was still working on it.

[03GT]

I don't recall anything about the cooler being done other than the cardboard mock up. Maybe I missed it(?). Anyway, really hoping he gets this kit done before I get snowed on. Lot's of new power to play with it completely useless on snow and ice.

[2003GT]

Thats when the real fun starts. :)

[03GT]

yeah, the waiting is making me nuts. It's like when we were kids the night before christmas, when you knew you were getting a kick *** presant.

[2003GT]

Hahahaha ya.

[2003GT]

Any body heard any Progress on this.

[dmdicks]

I predict that the kit will be available at a starting price of around 3500 USD sometime in 2009. How's that for an update? lol

[only1db]

i believe he is working on the ecu scan....a guy down here in florida has already been reflashed by tc a 2.7 supercharged...i'm sure he is just tweaking the maps so when he sells it you get the remapped ecu with it...

only thing is that you will have to use an 04 ecu or else you will throw a code for the wrong vin....unless he found a way around that.

[2003GT]

Cool I cant wait.

[i8acobra]

Yeah. I'm waiting patiently for this kit. Not doing anything to the car that won't work with the S/C. I might P&P my IM, but I can always sell that to someone.

[03GT]

yeah, been waiting and waiting and... waiting.. sigh.

[2003GT]

Christmas Never came Huh GT. :D

[cbogg]

only thing is that you will have to use an 04 ecu or else you will throw a code for the wrong vin....unless he found a way around that.

I know damn well you can program a VIN into a ECU, why couldn't you just send him your VIN and he'd pop it in there. And as far as I'm aware, you won't "throw a code" for having the VIN wrong, there's no way for the car to tell what the VIN plate says, only when you go for emissions tests and they don't match, then that could be a problem.

yeah, been waiting and waiting and... waiting.. sigh.

Rome wasn't built in a day, and neither were ANY performance parts for a hyundai, it'll be here soon enough.

[03GT]

I know damn well you can program a VIN into a ECU, why couldn't you just send him your VIN and he'd pop it in there. And as far as I'm aware, you won't "throw a code" for having the VIN wrong, there's no way for the car to tell what the VIN plate says, only when you go for emissions tests and they don't match, then that could be a problem.



Rome wasn't built in a day, and neither were ANY performance parts for a hyundai, it'll be here soon enough.

yeah, well winter's coming and there's no sense getting it in winter.. hearing that beautiful whine calling me to thrust the accellerator to the floor... yeah, not gonna happen on snow and ice. So, it won't be 'til next spring, like april. bah humbug. lol

And yeah, you won't pass smog if your vin plate and the vin in the puter don't match.

[only1db]

when you plug in a vin less ecu it will ask you to reprogram the vin...its how hyundai scan tools work.

unless you are never going to have it scanned...

and YES it will throw a code if the vin is not programmed.

[04GTboySC]

i want this to hapen so bad if this does come avail maybe it will urge me to keep my car haha

[nextgen03gt]

Hello,

I know its been a while, but I have been making some great progress. To answer the VIN code error upon reflash, I have a factory Hyundai scan tool and can read and write the VIN to a reflashed ECU. I reflashed an 06 Tib that we had the VIN code P0630 after the reflash. I plugged in the scan tool, input the VIN and code is gone. Just to make sure, I did a VIN read on it and it came up with his VIN, so thats not an issue.

Second, I have installed my base Enforcer kit on an 05 Tiburon 5 spd. No intercooling, stock injectors, stock throttle body, and no tuning. The car is your basic intake, header, and exhaust setup. I installed a 3.5" supercharger pulley to lower the boost. We ended up with 4.5lbs of boost across the curve with a peak of 5.5lbs at 6800 RPM. So far the car made 163whp and 160ftlbs @ 5500 RPM. From 2500 RPM to 5500 RPM we were at 13.0 AFR which is perfect for the boost we are running, but at 5500-6800 RPM we were in the mid 14's. So obviously the power dropped a little due to the leanness. I already have a simple fix for the this and will be installing it tomorrow and resume testing. I have a good feeling we will be seeing 170+whp with the extra enrichment on the base kit. Stay tuned as we are in the home stretch.

P.S. I have to say, the kit looks super nice installed. It looks like it came from Hyundai supercharged. The whole look in the engine compartment looks completely OE.
Thanks T.C.

[Pete03GLS]

im guessing this was on a I4 tib, right? sounds like good numbers for base kit.

[nextgen03gt]

Hello,

Yes, The Enforcer is an I4 kit.

Thanks T.C.

[Keyan]

Remember guys, my car dynoed stock at 106whp, 104wtq, so to get 70whp out of a kit without tuning or intercooling is AMAZING.

imagine this kit at 7psi (like the alpine kit was) with the cooler turned on!

I predict 190whp+ maybe?!?

[Pete03GLS]

holy hell.... im gonna have a tough choice to make in the coming months... which level kit to buy... hahahaha

[Keyan]

and also remember, that if he can hit 200whp, that's a 100% increase in power.

most bolt-on kits for cars these days only guarantee 50-60% increase in power.

[nextgen03gt]

Hello,

What was the most power the Alpine Kit made? I rememeber when Steve came to my shop years ago to try and work out the bugs with that kit. Does anyone know what peak power and torque were? Also what boost level and what mods it took? I remember Steve upped the boost to like 7-8lbs, installed injectors and a tuner, but thats the last I remember.

Thanks T.C.

[CRAZIECRACKER]

it was ***...

when is this going to be available? lol

[Keyan]

kylemorg i think has it running at 7lbs, and fordfastrr many years ago had it and it dynoed like 17x whp? i'd have to search the forums, and i'm way too lazy.

[cbogg]

ETA on a release date? pricing? let's go! lol

[Cypher]

Hello,

What was the most power the Alpine Kit made? I rememeber when Steve came to my shop years ago to try and work out the bugs with that kit. Does anyone know what peak power and torque were? Also what boost level and what mods it took? I remember Steve upped the boost to like 7-8lbs, installed injectors and a tuner, but thats the last I remember.

Thanks T.C.

For everyone else: Steve = Fordfasterr. He produced 176whp and I can't remember the tq. He was just using the SAFC to tune with 290cc injectors. He was only making 5psi on the gauge IIRC because he had an open exhaust system. Heres his big thread:

http://www.elantraxd.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3356

kylemorg i think has it running at 7lbs, and fordfastrr many years ago had it and it dynoed like 17x whp? i'd have to search the forums, and i'm way too lazy.

no need to search. Its in the FI sticky. See the link above.

[03GT]

The only thing worse than a cock tease is a boost tease.

[ricerrx7]

Remember guys, my car dynoed stock at 106whp, 104wtq, so to get 70whp out of a kit without tuning or intercooling is AMAZING.

First of all, you're comparing auto to 5 speed. And my car dyno'd with just an SRI at 128hp and 127lb/ft. So it's hard to judge one car off of another. I know that SRI didn't give me 22hp...

[Pete03GLS]

keyans is a 5spd... unless he dyno'ed before his swap.

[Keyan]

keyans is a 5spd... unless he dyno'ed before his swap.

I dynoed it stock a couple months after I bought it.

[2003GT]

Nice I cant wait I dream for the day when I can merge onto the highway and not have to worry about getting rear ended. :D

[SilverElantra]

cant wait for this.

[Silentwolf]

Nice I cant wait I dream for the day when I can merge onto the highway and not have to worry about getting rear ended. :D

Shift range, heard of it??

I'm often going faster on the entrance ramp than those on the freeway by the time i'm at the freeway.

[Pete03GLS]

Shift range, heard of it??

I'm often going faster on the entrance ramp than those on the freeway by the time i'm at the freeway.

i call it flooring it. because i also, usually travel faster on the on ramp, and the traffic.

[2003GT]

Ya well Thats what I do and it usually just gets me up there.

[Cypher]

See this thread from now on: http://www.elantraxd.com/forums/showthread.php?t=31782