dyno WTF A/F ratio

[jrod13]

I dynoed yesterday

the mods I have are a custom SRI, an OBX header, and a custom 2 1/4" inch exhaust with a full cat delete and one resonator and a proflo muffler. I also have NGK plug wires.

what the crap is up with my A/F ratio
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v728/jrod13/dynodayatelite003.jpg

[sed]

wow talk about a bad spot!!!

shawn :)

[mrhoaf]

might I recommend you get the 3800 rpm ECU flash done......

[2004ElantraGLS]

Holy ****! And I thought MY A/F ratio is jacked up! Try resetting the ECU. Also, definately get the 3,800 RPM thing reflashed. Then install an SAFC and trim that fuel back....there's easily another 5-8 whp there!

[jrod13]

might I recommend you get the 3800 rpm ECU flash done......
what the hell is the 3800 rpm ecu flash?

[mrhoaf]

ever notice that the engine hesitates just before 4000rpm... that it won't accelerate smoothly through those rpm's?

There's a TSB for a ECU reflash that the dealer can do that will fix that problem.

[sed]

http://www.hmaservice.com/webtech/iindex.asp?id=394895161#_394895161

[jrod13]

ever notice that the engine hesitates just before 4000rpm... that it won't accelerate smoothly through those rpm's?

There's a TSB for a ECU reflash that the dealer can do that will fix that problem.
what does the dealer charge to do this?

[sed]

TSB if you are in warranty its free

[jrod13]

TSB if you are in warranty its free
I technically have a warranty, but I probably voided once I started modding. I haven't been back to the dealer since I bought the car. Would this be something they would cover since I have a warranty even though I modded the car. Seeing as the drop in power at the 3800 really doesn't have anything to do with the mods.

[Pumbaa]

Print out the TSB then take it to them. They may question the Headers since that is technically voidable. But tell them that the TSB is not related to the headers, it is related to the ECU and it has been posted since you bought your car. They really shouldn't say they can't do anything since all they have to do is hook up a computer to the OBDII port for the ECU and retune the curve. I got it done and it helped. But I'll tell you, its not no 5-8 whp, maybe 1-2... All it does it even out the fuel curve and removes the dead spot. Check my dyno on 2-22-05, it shows a previous chart from January and then another run in february. Combare the two curve. One doesn't have the dead spot the other does. I also had installed a Ported Intake Manifold and Matched Throttle body, that is why there is a 5 whp gain....

[kylemorg]

Wow!!! Now I see why the car hesitates at 3800 RPM without the reflash!!! It's interesting to see on the dyno.

You can, of course, temporarily get rid of the hesitation by resetting the ECU... at least it worked for my car for ~200 miles or so, then came back until I reset it again. I kept resetting it every 200-300 miles until I got the reflash.

Good luck, and thanks for the dyno picture.

[jrod13]

hey guys i am going to bring back this thread one more time. I still have yet to get the TSB done to my car. That link up towards the top that Sed posted for me isn't letting me create an account for some unknown reason. If somebody that has had this done or has access to this information get me the # of the TSB. I just talked to the stealership and they didn't have any idea about that particular TSB so I figure if I can print it off and bring it to them it would make my life much simpler.

[Cypher]

contact dave he had it done several times. i didnt' realize it was taht bad even on manuals....

[2loud2k2xd]

this is only on the auto trans cars (for this particular tsb). and it will return, mine did after a month or so. now they want 180.00 to diagnose and re-flash (lmfao). and resetting the ecu doesnt work for me. even when i spray nitrous the hesitation is very much still present. why im only running a 15.5 1/4 mile :( one of many drawbacks to owning an auto. hence why we call them autotragics. lol

[jrod13]

So if it is just for the auto's why is my car doing that. And since it seems the car learns it's way around an SAFC and the like how do I fix that nasty fuel problem? When I run nitrous this summer I want it to be tuned for it.

[2loud2k2xd]

there is a different tsb for the 5spds. they have different ecm from the auto's to the mannys. and a safc will only work for a bit till the ECU overrides the settings and your back to square 1. this has been discussed soo many times i remember it by heart. i have been dealing with this hesitation for as long as ive owned the car. even kdm ecu's have this fault. therer is no real fix. the re=flash never really worked for me either. it just "numbed" thye hesitation and it came back fully not even a month later.

and how do you tune our cars for nitrous????? you just install the system, make sure yopu have adequate fuel supply, correct plugs and premium fuel and start spraying. then hope the install was done correctly or the motor blows up.
dave

[jrod13]

Uh you still want to tune for a nitrous application. I watched your video last night on streetfire of you dynoing. If you were tuned and had a good A/F ratio you would of gained way more then 35 hp off of an 80 shot.

[trahma]

and how do you tune our cars for nitrous????? you just install the system, make sure yopu have adequate fuel supply, correct plugs and premium fuel and start spraying. then hope the install was done correctly or the motor blows up.
dave

and this is why people call nitrous unsafe. I know it's a hard concept to grasp, but reading the instructions (http://www.zex.com/Base/Instructions/ZEX132.pdf) is probably a smart thing to do when installing something that can be as volatile as nitrous.

http://www.webninja.org/zexinstructions.jpg

I'm sure they meant the timing thing as a suggestion and forgot to tell you. :confused:

[2loud2k2xd]

lol, tell me how to tune our cars and ill do it. there is nothing that we can do to tune our cars. the ECU WILL OVERIDE anything we do. OMG..we have been thru this many many times before.

[Cypher]

dave did you try pm'ing kdmguy to see if theres anything he can do for you? he does retuned ecus. and its my opinion that if you were to get something like the smt-6 or greddy emanage that you'd be able to tune the car properly without worry of it getting overriden

[only1db]

^ um....yeah thats because you totally take the stock ecu out!! LOL!! or atleast take it out of the picture for engine management....

[Cypher]

well he said tell him how to tune the ecu ;)

[2loud2k2xd]

listen guys, ive talked to joonie from kspec, shark racing, and a couple kdm guys about aftermarket STOCK ECU's. there is nothing we can do about an aftermarket ecu for a nitrous set-up. the shark racing ecu will not work because of the timing changes they do to it. when running nitrous applications (below a 100 shot) you dont need to change the timing. any aftermarket ecu uses an upgraded timing. even a direct swap of a factory kdm ecu will still have the 3800 auto trans hesitation (from what ive been told by 3 or 4 different people). i have talked to sooo many people over the years about this and came up with the same conclusion...there is nothing that can be done. untill the ecu fairy can tweak hyundai's locked ecu's, we are SOL.

ford, please chime in on this one. thanks

i want an ecu with the factory timing, but with out the hesitation. so far i have came up with nothing. untill then, ill just have to deal with the lack of power once i hit 3rd gear. re-setting the ecu does nothing for me anymore about this.

also from my understanding a smt-6 might help, but im not wasting 600.00+ on a hope it will work. there was a guy on newtib that had a smt-5, but it was sold before i could buy it.

[ArunSenior04]

You guys should have a convo with KDMGuy over this. Im almost positive he could help you guys out with timing, ecu stuff, and a/f ratios.

[2loud2k2xd]

i just sent him a pm to give some info on this.
dave

[2loud2k2xd]

ok, ive been talking with kdm guy in pm's about this. he said he can do the kdm ecu's without the 3800 rpm hesitation, as well as some power upgrades. 300.00 +150.00 (with the power upgrades) core deposit returned once they get your old ecu back. not sure the cost of just a stock kdm ecu, still waiting to talk to him a bit more. if the stock ecu that i need is a decent price, ill be a guinnea pig, and hope it will work.

[yamaha]

Dave, A SMT-6 can be had new for 300 shipped, thats where I got mine. To give some more knowledge on the subject, not everything will be overriden. A piggyback or standalone will not be overriden by the ECU. I have my SMT-6 installed on my car as we speak with my wideband and nothing has changed since I installed it. The SMT-6 is VERY in depth with what it can do, it will blow the SAFC out of the water. A remapped stock ECU will not do the trick for everything. Dave, if you need a hookup on a SMT-5 or SMT-6 for 150-300 bucks, let me know. I can hook you up.

[2loud2k2xd]

Dave, A SMT-6 can be had new for 300 shipped, thats where I got mine. To give some more knowledge on the subject, not everything will be overriden. A piggyback or standalone will not be overriden by the ECU. I have my SMT-6 installed on my car as we speak with my wideband and nothing has changed since I installed it. The SMT-6 is VERY in depth with what it can do, it will blow the SAFC out of the water. A remapped stock ECU will not do the trick for everything. Dave, if you need a hookup on a SMT-5 or SMT-6 for 150-300 bucks, let me know. I can hook you up.


DONE, pm me the info and ill buy it. but i would like the smt-6 as it has alot more features than the 5. felix (kewlkat) told me about this a while back, but with all the talk about our unlockable ecu's, i blew it off. i wonder if this will even out my pig f'n rich a/f ratio while i spray??? but how would a smt-6 get rid of the rpm problem? thats what i dont get. its locked into the ecu and needs re-flashing to remove..or so i thought? and i read a bit about it and the hook-up sounds a bit dicey. tapping into the factory ecu wiring scares me a bit. but it shouldnt be a big deal.
well, now theres 2 possibilities to this for jrod, the smt5 or 6, or the ecu upgrade. ill let you know more when i hear back from kdmguy.

[yamaha]

The SMT-6 is a simple 6 wires into the ECU from what I did and some other ones. If you go to Perfect Power's website, they have a diagram of all the wires that need to be hooked up. Ill call my friend and see if he can still get SMT's. I bought mine off of a guy from NewTiburon, but soon found a local person selling them for about 310 shipped new. Ill get back to you Dave.

[trahma]

lol, tell me how to tune our cars and ill do it. there is nothing that we can do to tune our cars. the ECU WILL OVERIDE anything we do. OMG..we have been thru this many many times before.

http://www.msdignition.com/sci_4.htm

Your computer isn't going to learn around a change for the spray.

Not to mention you just made this post (http://www.elantraxd.com/forums/showpost.php?p=161841&postcount=27) today.

[jrod13]

The SMT-6 has been offered to me for $200 plus tuning. Once I do the nitrous I am going to take them up on this offer. I will hopefully be running over 200 at the wheels with a 80 shot.

[2loud2k2xd]

http://www.msdignition.com/sci_4.htm

Your computer isn't going to learn around a change for the spray.

Not to mention you just made this post (http://www.elantraxd.com/forums/showpost.php?p=161841&postcount=27) today.


a msd ignition will do nothing but provide a much better spark delivery to the plug than the stock coil pack can, and yes it can slightly change timing. but from my understanding any nitrous application spraying a 100 shot or less, the factory timing is ok. i have no problems with spark or timing. everything runs excellent when i spray, but the rpm hesitation. i am talking about overriding/re-writing the ecu's factory settings to get a better performance tuning. like most other vehicle lines where you can re-tune/re-program the ecu to do what you want it to do as far as performance upgrades, ours is unlockable at this time. there is no company that can re-program the ecu's.

and im not looking for my ecu to change because of the nitrous. i want my ecu to NOT have the damn rpm hesitation. the spray is just a power adder and nothing on the ecu needs to be changed for the nitrous.

[trahma]

a msd ignition will do nothing but provide a much better spark delivery to the plug than the stock coil pack can, and yes it can slightly change timing. but from my understanding any nitrous application spraying a 100 shot or less, the factory timing is ok. i have no problems with spark or timing. everything runs excellent when i spray, but the rpm hesitation. i am talking about overriding/re-writing the ecu's factory settings to get a better performance tuning. like most other vehicle lines where you can re-tune/re-program the ecu to do what you want it to do as far as performance upgrades, ours is unlockable at this time. there is no company that can re-program the ecu's.

and im not looking for my ecu to change because of the nitrous. i want my ecu to NOT have the damn rpm hesitation. the spray is just a power adder and nothing on the ecu needs to be changed for the nitrous.

Spraying nitrous causes a large increase in cylinder pressure. Especially with a larger shot. If you like detonation, sure run the stock timing. The statements you're making sound simply like you haven't had a problem, so you're being ignorant to what could happen.

Anything that adds power to a vehicle is going to affect the way your car runs, thus can modify how your tune should be setup. Adding lots of power from nitrous is no different. An MSD DIS does much more than deliver better spark. If you read the description at the link I sent you'd realize that. Running nitrous safely is more than installing a kit and going, then assuming because nothing has happened everything is ok.

[KeWLKaT]

^ I agree.

Spark might need to be retarded for instance. MSD does that.

[2loud2k2xd]

i fully understand the bennifits of a msd ignition. yes i do read this **** man. and ive been told by numerous people timing does not need to be adjusted for anything less than a 100 shot. 1 reason why people use a 1* colder plug or a 2* colder plug...to prevent detonation. it doesnt matter for me know, cause i have a buyer for the nitrous system. so i dont care about that issue. now i'm working on something to get rid of the rpm hesitation like was the origional post was about. i didnt meant to hijack this thread, but it turned out that way, jrod (i appologise).
dave

[Vampyrate]

ok, ive been talking with kdm guy in pm's about this. he said he can do the kdm ecu's without the 3800 rpm hesitation, as well as some power upgrades. 300.00 +150.00 (with the power upgrades) core deposit returned once they get your old ecu back. not sure the cost of just a stock kdm ecu, still waiting to talk to him a bit more. if the stock ecu that i need is a decent price, ill be a guinnea pig, and hope it will work.
so is the core charge the 300? or an amount within that?

[2loud2k2xd]

no, its 300.00 for the new reflashed ecu and a 150.00 core charge. the 150.00 is refunded once they get your old ecu.

[kdmguy]

And I will be also able to have it premium gas setting so that your gas mileage and overall performance get a lot better @ higher octane.
I can get rid of fuel cut, speed limit, etc to any ECUs.
Just let me know
Thanks
KDMguy

[only1db]

i think we found the solution!!

kdm....you better start an assembly line!!

cutting out the govenor uh??? no more hesitation....