[HD] US government opens investigation into '07-08 Hyundai Elantra after reports of engine [Archive] - Hyundai Elantra Forum

: [HD] US government opens investigation into '07-08 Hyundai Elantra after reports of engine



cclngthr
07-22-2008, 11:12 PM
US government opens investigation into '07-08 Hyundai Elantra after reports of engine stalling

The Associated Press
Monday, July 21, 2008

WASHINGTON: The government is investigating 2007-2008 model year Hyundai Elantra compact cars after receiving reports of engine stalling, officials said Monday.

The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration said in a posting on its Web site that its preliminary investigation involves about 167,000 Elantras. NHTSA said it has received four reports of engine stalling because of problems with the vehicle's fuel pump module.

One owner said the car stalled in the fast lane of a three-lane highway and caused a crash involving three cars and one injury. Three of the four reports involved vehicles with only 600 miles (1,000 kilometers) or less; the fourth vehicle had 2,839 miles (4,568 kilometers) at the time.

Hyundai Motor Co. spokesman Miles Johnson said Monday it was too early in the process to draw any conclusions about the alleged safety issue. He said Hyundai was cooperating with NHTSA on the investigation.

U.S. sales of the Elantra grew more than 50 percent in June to nearly 14,500 vehicles for the month as consumers responded to gasoline prices that have exceeded $4-a-gallon ($1.05 a liter).

yamaha
07-22-2008, 11:16 PM
Interesting.

Pete03GLS
07-22-2008, 11:17 PM
have u had any problems with yours???

hyunelan2
07-22-2008, 11:20 PM
FOUR reports out of 167,000 cars. Math says that's 0.002% of them. That doesn't seem very high, but still interesting to note that Hyundai may have received half-a-dozen bad fuel pumps/modules.

cclngthr
07-22-2008, 11:22 PM
Not yet. Apparently, a lot of people are. Derek said in a similar thread that he's replaced 10 HD pump/regulator/sending unit assemblies in HD's. I'm going by what Derek said that the fuel regulator is faulty causing it to have a internal leak causing the engine to stall suddenly.


FOUR reports out of 167,000 cars. Math says that's 0.002% of them. That doesn't seem very high, but still interesting to note that Hyundai may have received half-a-dozen bad fuel pumps/modules.

I read where Derek replaced 10 of the bad units at his shop.

03GT
07-22-2008, 11:31 PM
yeah, sounds like a bad lot of fuel pumps. Any time you mass produce anything you're going to have these kinds of problems. Remember the big laptop battery recall a couple years back?

SuperGLS
07-22-2008, 11:55 PM
It could be another class action lawsuit in the making, HD style.



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cclngthr
07-23-2008, 12:44 AM
It could be another class action lawsuit in the making, HD style.

Don't know yet. Only 4 reports to NHTSA have been reported; although more cars likely have had the problem that have not had been reported. HMA will have to disclose how many fuel pump/regulator assemblies they have replaced for those model years and what changes were made to the assembly.

only1db
07-23-2008, 07:41 AM
more info but i'm not at liberty...i really shouldnt know....i'm sure it will come out...its the pump (as per source) not the regulator like tech line told us.


i replaced 5 more in the last week....

BobMs_wht2k2
07-23-2008, 08:21 AM
bUT AS A "SERIOUS saftey concern". . that makes me laugh. If you cannot handle a vehicle that stalls, you shouldn't be driving.

Keyan
07-23-2008, 08:32 AM
i foresee a recall

Cujo8me
07-23-2008, 08:52 AM
i second that

UrbanerMezei
07-23-2008, 09:25 AM
What the ****?

I've driven 43 000 km there is nothing wrong with the bloody thing...

03GT
07-23-2008, 11:56 AM
right that's why my thoughts are that it's just a bad "lot" of pumps they got from their manufacturer.

themarin8r
07-23-2008, 12:03 PM
i dont think this would merit a class action lawsuit, but i am not a law person by any means
as long as Hyundai does the right thing and replaces these and/or issues a recall if its a significant percentage, i do not foresee anything bad happening as a result

CornbreadXD
07-23-2008, 12:08 PM
why didn't they just hit the hazards and pull out instead of crashing? wtf were they doing?

themarin8r
07-23-2008, 12:14 PM
most people do not know what is going on when something goes wrong with the car
and most people do not know what to do when they dont know whats going on

what is scary is when your timing belt snaps in your 95 escort wagon going uphill with two semi's behind you haha

03GT
07-23-2008, 12:34 PM
why didn't they just hit the hazards and pull out instead of crashing? wtf were they doing?

I've never had a pump go out but I imagine it's like running out of gas where the car kinda spits and sputters a bit before going out all together. I guess I've been lucky never having a car break down to the point where I couldn't pull off somewhere. But yeah, you gotta wonder what they were thinking when the car lost power, it's not like the thing just instantly stops and all things stop working. I imagine the electric steering would still work, the brakes would work although harder to push the pedal down.

Makes me think of the episode of top gear where they're driving 10,000$ super cars and the maserati blows the engine and loses brakes. Jeremy just pulls off the side of the road and runs the car in to an embankment.

cclngthr
07-23-2008, 12:39 PM
more info but I'm not at liberty...i really shouldn't know....i'm sure it will come out...its the pump (as per source) not the regulator like tech line told us.


i replaced 5 more in the last week....

Interesting. Not the regulator. I was going by what you said (regulator taking a dump; leaking internally). If it is the pump, that is an easy fix. Have a Walbro 190 handy and ready to install....

This is not anything about the ability to drive. It is why the car unexpectedly stalls and becomes a dangerous situation. The pump is unable to deliver the pressure for some reason and can do this intermittently.


I've never had a pump go out but I imagine it's like running out of gas where the car kinda spits and sputters a bit before going out all together. I guess I've been lucky never having a car break down to the point where I couldn't pull off somewhere. But yeah, you gotta wonder what they were thinking when the car lost power, it's not like the thing just instantly stops and all things stop working. I imagine the electric steering would still work, the brakes would work although harder to push the pedal down.

Makes me think of the episode of top gear where they're driving 10,000$ super cars and the maserati blows the engine and loses brakes. Jeremy just pulls off the side of the road and runs the car in to an embankment.

It sounds like the sudden drop in fuel pressure makes the car stall out suddenly from the description.

BobMs_wht2k2
07-23-2008, 12:44 PM
Actually, it IS about the drivers inability to drive. The car does not come sliding to a stop. It slows down, and then dies. Coasting to a stop. Nottires locked, smoke billowing dead in the middle of the road.

themarin8r
07-23-2008, 12:55 PM
ive ran out of gas once, and the car starts to sputter and becomes harder to steer and drive (in my cavalier at least)
you get indications that the car isnt getting fuel for a little while, at least long enough to pull over, unless its heavy traffic and you are in the middle lane

Cypher
07-23-2008, 01:08 PM
Even then just hit the hazards and work your way to the side. If you have your hazards flashing and you are slowing down, then most people should figure out that you have something going on.

cclngthr
07-23-2008, 01:22 PM
Actually, it IS about the drivers inability to drive. The car does not come sliding to a stop. It slows down, and then dies. Coasting to a stop. Nottires locked, smoke billowing dead in the middle of the road.

In gear, it will slow down quite fast. At a high speed, even if you were in 5th gear, the rate of slowdown is just as fast as you shifting from 5th to 2nd gear (talking about going 65-70 mph here). By the time you react to push the clutch in (most people do not rest their foot on the clutch pedal) you are going MUCH slower than 65-70 mph.


Even then just hit the hazards and work your way to the side. If you have your hazards flashing and you are slowing down, then most people should figure out that you have something going on.

In congested areas, likely not.

This is NOT about the ability to drive. It is about why the fuel pump suddenly drops fuel pressure and causes a car to stall. The NHTSA has to assume the traffic is heavy and the ability to get over from the middle lane. People don't necessarily ALLOW you to get over that easily even with hazards on.

Keyan
07-23-2008, 01:33 PM
you guys are forgetting that when the car stalls, the brakes loose their vacuum and it becomes MUCH harder to stop. if we are talking about either inexperienced drivers or the elderly, an accident can very well happen.

BobMs_wht2k2
07-23-2008, 01:33 PM
Colin, this IS about the drivers inability to drive. You can make up whatever you want to (and I know you will, because you never stop)but the fact remains that a car stalling in gear will not cause massive pileups. The car will not slide to a stop. The car will still be steerable and still have brakes.

03GT
07-23-2008, 01:38 PM
I know how hard the brakes can be to push when the engine stalls out. Maybe I'm just use to it having driven numerous "old" cars that didn't have power brakes at all. The worst was a 29 model A. Drum brakes all the way around. You had to mash the living sh!t out of the pedal to get that thing to stop. Just because the engine stalls doesn't mean the E-brake won't work our you cant down shift your gearbox. Worst case scenerio you run your car in to the ditch/rail so you don't hit anybody else.

UrbanerMezei
07-23-2008, 01:45 PM
And experienced driver will try to stay in control of the car as long as possible to slow it down, and if that isn't possible will put it in the ditch as opposed to hitting someone else..

I'd rather kiss the guard rail or go flying into a ditch than I would put someone else's life at risk.

cclngthr
07-23-2008, 03:04 PM
Colin, this IS about the drivers inability to drive. You can make up whatever you want to (and I know you will, because you never stop)but the fact remains that a car stalling in gear will not cause massive pileups. The car will not slide to a stop. The car will still be steerable and still have brakes.

Not very easily, especially with the drive wheels being the ones you steer with. What you and Adam don't get is the front wheels will be under a lot of resistance because the wheels will be turning the engine over instead of freewheeling. With the engine NOT running, and the trans in gear, it will be under resistance at the front wheels. It will not freewheel (under zero resistance) as you seem to think it will be.

UrbanerMezei
07-23-2008, 03:09 PM
Not very easily, especially with the drive wheels being the ones you steer with. What you and Adam don't get is the front wheels will be under a lot of resistance because the wheels will be turning the engine over instead of freewheeling. With the engine NOT running, and the trans in gear, it will be under resistance at the front wheels. It will not freewheel (under zero resistance) as you seem to think it will be.

Put the car into neutral? :stupid:

NovaResource
07-23-2008, 03:18 PM
Not very easily, especially with the drive wheels being the ones you steer with. What you and Adam don't get is the front wheels will be under a lot of resistance because the wheels will be turning the engine over instead of freewheeling. With the engine NOT running, and the trans in gear, it will be under resistance at the front wheels. It will not freewheel (under zero resistance) as you seem to think it will be.

Why is this so hard for you to understand?

Nobody on in this thread or the thread in the other forum said it will be "freewheeling" with "zero resistance". Yes, there will be resistance but no more than the normal application of the brakes. The torque converter in an automatic will prevent the wheels from trying to turn the engine and all you have to do is step on the clutch with a manual trans. If you can't do that, you suck at driving and shouldn't be behind the wheel.

For the last time, a stalled engine is NOT a safety issue. If you don't know how to handle an engine stalling at speed you shouldn't be driving.

YOU behind the wheel of a car IS a safety issue.

hotbod4you
07-23-2008, 03:23 PM
Colin, this IS about the drivers inability to drive. You can make up whatever you want to (and I know you will, because you never stop)but the fact remains that a car stalling in gear will not cause massive pileups. The car will not slide to a stop. The car will still be steerable and still have brakes.

I work at a Honda Dealership. They like to ship cars with very little fuel. On my way to get fuel last week in a new Accord I ran out of gas. Trust me, the brakes still work and so does the steering. It's like coasting with a lack of power steering and at high speeds you don't really need that anyways. If a lack of fuel causes someone to smash into other car they shouldn't be driving. My guess: People get freaked out their car has stalled a slam on the brakes. These people like "anyone who uses their brakes on the motorway should probably be murdered anyways".
Quote from Clarkson

jalmir
07-23-2008, 03:23 PM
Not very easily, especially with the drive wheels being the ones you steer with. What you and Adam don't get is the front wheels will be under a lot of resistance because the wheels will be turning the engine over instead of freewheeling. With the engine NOT running, and the trans in gear, it will be under resistance at the front wheels. It will not freewheel (under zero resistance) as you seem to think it will be.

I don't have power steering, yet I don't have any problems steering at any speed, turning the wheel when stopped is what is hard, while the car is moving, turning the wheels is not much harder that with a PS!

BobMs_wht2k2
07-23-2008, 03:29 PM
Why is this so hard for you to understand?

Nobody on in this thread or the thread in the other forum said it will be "freewheeling" with "zero resistance". Yes, there will be resistance but no more than the normal application of the brakes. The torque converter in an automatic will prevent the wheels from trying to turn the engine and all you have to do is step on the clutch with a manual trans. If you can't do that, you suck at driving and shouldn't be behind the wheel.

For the last time, a stalled engine is NOT a safety issue. If you don't know how to handle an engine stalling at speed you shouldn't be driving.

YOU behind the wheel of a car IS a safety issue.

Save your typing/breath. He's already made up his (little) mind on this and the entire world is too stupid to realize he's right. Just like the whole "Got to change calipers, pads and rotors and line all at the same time, even at 30k miles. It's the law" crap he pulled the last time.

03GT
07-23-2008, 04:33 PM
^^ Uh oh, I haven't even looked at my brakes and I'm at 54,000mi. Is the po-po gonna get me?

BobMs_wht2k2
07-23-2008, 04:43 PM
According to Colin, yes! Make sure you replace every componenet in the brake system when you get you fuel pump changed.

ricerrx7
07-23-2008, 04:44 PM
you guys are forgetting that when the car stalls, the brakes loose their vacuum and it becomes MUCH harder to stop. if we are talking about either inexperienced drivers or the elderly, an accident can very well happen.

And you are forgetting that there is a check valve that will allow for 3 assisted applications of the brake pedal after the engine shuts off...

And Colin, here's one of your quotes from the other forum:


Get off your ****ing high horse. I am ****ing tired of you and a bunch of people here saying I know nothing about what I'm talking about.



Maybe you should look at the fact that you admitted that a bunch of people disagree with you. Maybe, just maybe, you should start looking at the reason so many people disagree with you, and very few agree with you...

03GT
07-23-2008, 06:12 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iO8UA8R6HVc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZTSmF9zt_Q
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XI_gNQLmTM0&feature=related

shouldn't they have all crashed and died? I guess they didn't because they weren't running firestone tires.

cclngthr
07-23-2008, 06:29 PM
Maybe you should look at the fact that you admitted that a bunch of people disagree with you. Maybe, just maybe, you should start looking at the reason so many people disagree with you, and very few agree with you...

When people force their theory onto me is the problem. Instead of not responding, you demand that I accept your theory as reality. Things don't go that way.


Nobody on in this thread or the thread in the other forum said it will be "freewheeling" with "zero resistance". Yes, there will be resistance but no more than the normal application of the brakes. The torque converter in an automatic will prevent the wheels from trying to turn the engine and all you have to do is step on the clutch with a manual trans. If you can't do that, you suck at driving and shouldn't be behind the wheel.

What makes you think all cars have a torque converter and an automatic transmission? They do not. A lot of cars have manual transmissions. In a situation like this, NHTSA must assume there is a manual transmission in the car because the manual transmission is a standard option. Automatic transmissions are an option, not standard equipment on the HD. A torque converter will allow the drive wheels to turn a lot easier. A standard shift manual transmission does not do that. A manual transmission has the clutch which connects the engine to the transmission and has the force to connect the two parts directly. That is what I'M talking about.

ricerrx7
07-23-2008, 06:58 PM
Because you don't force anything on people? The difference is when you are proven wrong, you refuse to admit it, and will argue til you're blue in the face and look ridiculous.
And look at the quote in your post again. Here I'll point out the part I'm referring to:
"The torque converter in an automatic will prevent the wheels from trying to turn the engine and all you have to do is step on the clutch with a manual trans."
Do you even read before you argue?

NovaResource
07-23-2008, 07:59 PM
What makes you think all cars have a torque converter and an automatic transmission? They do not. A lot of cars have manual transmissions. In a situation like this, NHTSA must assume there is a manual transmission in the car because the manual transmission is a standard option. Automatic transmissions are an option, not standard equipment on the HD. A torque converter will allow the drive wheels to turn a lot easier. A standard shift manual transmission does not do that. A manual transmission has the clutch which connects the engine to the transmission and has the force to connect the two parts directly. That is what I'M talking about.

You didn't read my whole post very well. Maybe this will help:

Nobody on in this thread or the thread in the other forum said it will be "freewheeling" with "zero resistance". Yes, there will be resistance but no more than the normal application of the brakes. The torque converter in an automatic will prevent the wheels from trying to turn the engine and all you have to do is step on the clutch with a manual trans. If you can't do that, you suck at driving and shouldn't be behind the wheel.

BobMs_wht2k2
07-23-2008, 08:13 PM
Why again MUST the NHTSA assume they are all manual trans when a vast majority of automobiles in the US DON'T EVEN OFFER a manual trans?

Cujo8me
07-23-2008, 08:40 PM
does everyone here for get thet the 07-08 elantras have electronic assist steering???

jalmir
07-23-2008, 08:41 PM
wait ... what ???

a MT car that stalls locks the steering wheel ... WOW I just learned something!!!

ricerrx7
07-23-2008, 08:43 PM
does everyone here for get thet the 07-08 elantras have electronic assist steering???

And did you forget that it won't make a difference?

UrbanerMezei
07-23-2008, 09:42 PM
Or you know... put the car in neutral...

Btw electric steering turns off with the car but as long as the key is in the ignition it remains unlocked, you just have to work those pretty little arms of yours.

Cypher
07-23-2008, 09:55 PM
While I do agree with all the points that everyone else has brought up, I'm going ot lock this because I know where its headed. If you have a problem, PM me.